I'm sorry for the absence. A number of factors, including school, writer's block, and drama, prevented me from posting.
I'm feeling a little philosophical this evening, and a little spiritual, so my focus is Obama's not-so-recent (yes, I'm late) remark about the United States is not a Christian country. My initial reaction was to close my jaw; my friend, who had passed on this information, laughed. I had to check for myself, and sure enough, in a local news article, there it was.
I live in the South, have been raised Southern, so to hear a generalization that the country ISN"T Christian made me look around and question, "Dude, where have you been all these years?!" It is not for nothing that America wears a "Bible Belt". Yes, there are atheists and Wiccans here, but the majority are self-proclaimed "saved" Christians.
Our very nation was founded on Christianity, by people who came seeking religious freedom and tolerance (hypocrites though they were). The men who signed the Declaration believed in a God, as did their children and their children's children. The Constitution was written with Christian principles. Modern-day America claims to have more than half of its people listed Christian. Where, then, does Obama find the country to be not so?
Of course, I am overlooking the obviousness of this statement. It is true that, internationally, we are known for supporting many religions and thus are not specifically Christian. Nor, do I think, are we listed officially so (correct me if I am wrong!).
What I seek are the deeper implications-and wonder if this wasn't a Freudian slip.
Upon closer examination, I am startled to realize the nature of the public. Every day people are on the streets, with signs pleading help, but are consistently ignored by the Bible-thumping neighbors who live next to you. Every day a person, young, old, healthy, sick, falls, to the sound of laughter and often derision. In the evenings, people are beaten, raped, mugged, et cetera by those who claim to love.
Does this sound Christian? Christ-like?
For those who do not share the Christian faith, I'm certain you are familiar with the golden rule (that Jesus, as strictly a historical figure, preached): "Do unto others as you would have done unto yourself". Would you like to be ignored? Would you go to church, shout "AMEN!" and then pass by homeless folk without any regard that (given the state of the economy and housing market) it could be you? ("Moment" by Emerson Drive comes to mind).
I know good people exist; I've met them, been a recipient of their care. But as long as we, as a people, continue to turn a blind eye, we validate Obama's words in ways unimaginable.
The Constitution was written with Christian principles.
That's just a coincidence
The Constitution is not based on Christian principles anymore than it's based on Jewish principles, humanist principles, MY principles, etc. It just happens to have some elements that coincide with Christianity. It has others - freedom of religion and freedom of speech come to mind- that are in direct opposition to Christianity.
But as long as we, as a people, continue to turn a blind eye, we validate Obama's words in ways unimaginable.
America can never be a Christian country. It was founded on sin. Too many commandments were broken to create this country as it is. Namely...
Thou shall not kill
Thou shall not steal
Thou shall not covet thy neighbor's house
Thou shall have no other gods before me
Thou shall not make for yourself an idol
I disagree. We validated Obama's words when we stopped burning "witches", freed the slaves, and recognized equal rights for all races and both sexes. All progress comes at the expense of biblical traditions.
it's a misconception that Islam was spread with the sword, it's as much violent as Christianity or Judaism...or any other religion that tries to gain followers.
We, Muslims, in Islam do believe that Jesus was a prophet who came to spread the word about Islam...and Islam has been the religion all prophet's tried to preach.
“You cannot wean away an addict from the drug. It is not possible for me to walk away from Ranjha. If it is our destiny to be together then who, other than God, can change it?”
she's a spaceman, no walker, dreamer...maybe
Give me three examples of Jews committing violence on a large scale because of conversion drives or overtly religious goals. Judaism is shrinking because it specifically eschews aggressively seeking new converts. Even in Israel/palestine the issues are as much or more cultural and historical as opposed to religious.
“Existentialism means that no one else can take a bath for you” - Delmore Schwartz
"Patriotism is often an arbitrary veneration of real-estate above principles." - George Jean Nathan
"Give me three examples of Jews committing violence on a large scale because of...overtly religious goals"
Zionism?
Where have you been? If you need two more examples read the Bible.
Unless you consider the entire Jewish people a 'cultural and historical' entity not a religion then I suppose you could disregard all of the religious basis for fighting over the 'Holly Land' from their perspective.
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends upon the unreasonable man."
- George Bernard Shaw
I wouldn't dismiss it entirely, on either side, but I don't think that religion is the largest contributing factor. I think that the conflict would be lessened if both sides were of the same religion, but not eliminated. Land and borders are as important as cultural/religious things.
Besides, that's one, alright maybe you could three specific acts out of it, but
where's the Jewish crusades or Jewish Inquisition?
Of the Abrahamic religions Judaism is the most peaceful and least violent by a far, far margin. It's also the oldest, so they had a head-start.
To be fair, my Bible reading isn't exactly extensive, but where in the Bible do the Jews go about slaughtering people? I mean, they had some harsh punishments for some silly things back in the day, but that was pretty par for the course and contained within the Jews themselves, not imposed upon all and sundry.
Either way, historically Christians and Muslims are by far the nastier religious folk. That's the point.
“Existentialism means that no one else can take a bath for you” - Delmore Schwartz
"Patriotism is often an arbitrary veneration of real-estate above principles." - George Jean Nathan
To be fair, my Bible reading isn't exactly extensive, but where in the Bible do the Jews go about slaughtering people?
The old testament is FILLED with genocidal rampages...
The Hittites, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Perizzites, the Hivites and the Jebusites were all slaughtered by the ancient Israelites at the command of "the LORD."
To be fair, however, I think that the centuries of oppression faced by the Jewish people has tempered their character as a people, and there seems to be a cultural awareness among modern Jews that mitigates the violent tendencies of their religion in light of knowing what it really means to be on the receiving end of this kind of violence. That same empathy does not seem to be shared, however, by their christian and islamic cousins.
TTFN,
Blackout
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A question of love.
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Check out Progressive PRIDE, a Gay-Straight Alliance for the Progressive U community.
I consider myself schooled. As you say though, modern Jews are far less, uhhm, aggressive.
“Existentialism means that no one else can take a bath for you” - Delmore Schwartz
"Patriotism is often an arbitrary veneration of real-estate above principles." - George Jean Nathan
Excellent examples from the Bible. Since it is the version of history preserved by the Jews, it is most likely not intended to make them look WORSE than they actually were.
One of the basic differences is that Judaism is an exclusionary religion which discourages conversions and mixing with others through marriage, while Christianity or Islam are both very aggressively expansionist. Much of the violent history of those religions had a direct relation to attempting to convert the world to their faith. Interestingly Judaism ended its' less violent period by seeking to regain their historical homeland. Since that struggle began they are an equal for anyone when it comes to violence, which is exacerbated by their exclusion of other beliefs/races.
"It is only by risking our persons from one hour to another that we live at all. And often enough our faith beforehand in an uncertified result is the only thing that makes the result come true."
- William James
Judaism hasn't sought followers since around the time Jesus supposedly lived. After the Second Temple was destroyed, they stopped seeking converts.
~C
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The men who signed the Declaration believed in a God, as did their children and their children's children.
Not all of them, and this was a fact that was very clear to the men you mention. For example, Thomas Jefferson (the main author of the Declaration) wrote this in his autobiography...
The Constitution was written with Christian principles.
Actually, there is nothing unique to christianity in the principles of the U.S. Constitution. If one was going to seek a source for the principles enshrined therein, one would have more success looking back to the government of the Greek and Roman Empires. In fact, our Congress specifically rejected this notion during its 5th session in a treaty that was written at the direction of our first president George Washington (who was a deist at most), passed unanimously by our Senate and signed into Law by our second president, John Adams. The Treaty of Tripoli stated in very plain terms...
Modern-day America claims to have more than half of its people listed Christian.
That's a modern phenomenon. Prior to the Civil War, less than half of U.S. citizens identified themselves as "christian." At the time of the founding, the figure among common U.S. citizens was even less. It was during the Second Great Awakening (which began in the 1790's) that congregationalism began to spread and the largely secular U.S. culture began to become more predominantly religious.
But as long as we, as a people, continue to turn a blind eye, we validate Obama's words in ways unimaginable.
The only blind eye here is the blind eye that many modern christians have turned to the actual history of our nation, which was founded very intentionally and specifically to be a secular union which left governing to the government, and religion to those citizens who wished to participate in it.
TTFN,
Blackout
---
A question of love.
---
Check out Progressive PRIDE, a Gay-Straight Alliance for the Progressive U community.
Great post!
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