The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, whose members are commonly known as Mormons, is a rather controversial organization based on their religious beliefs. Many find the missions these people do objectionable, some object to the very foundation of the religion (through the book of Mormon), and others object to various practices of the church, including the exclusion of non-members from various practices.
Did you know that this particular Church does post-humous baptisms? I didn't either, until I heard of a controversy between many Jews and the church, objecting to the practice of baptizing Holocaust victims.
These baptisms are done in the belief that they help reunite the families of the members. Basically, it stems from the belief that if you aren't Mormon, you won't go to Heaven, or whatever. Those who are married in the Mormon church are believed to have eternal marriages, those that survive after death. So, members often want to baptize their family members after death, so they might be reunited.
Well, about thirteen years ago, there was an agreement made between the Church and a US Jewish group to end the practice of baptizing Holocaust victims (save in instances where living descendants of the victims were Mormon). Many saw this as offensive, particularly because they believe these individuals died for their religion.
They've recently resumed this practice of baptizing these victims, causing some Jews to become upset.
"They tell me, that my parents' Jewishness has not been altered but,100 years from now, how will they be able to guarantee that my mother and father of blessed memory who lived as Jews and were slaughtered by Hitler for no other reason than they were Jews, will someday not be identified as Mormon victims of the Holocaust?"
Of course, other Jews don't understand what the fuss is about, since the baptism, in their belief, does absolutely nothing for the victim.
Some Mormons are advocating this for purely religious reasons, such as this commenter: "We are only trying to help those poor souls get to Heaven. The Bible teaches that the only way to get to Heaven is through Jesus. Through Jesus is the ONLY way. We are only trying to give these heathen souls a chance to be saved and get to Heaven. What could Jews possibly have against going to Heaven rather than burning in Hell for eternity? Do you really want all those dead Jews to burn in Hell forever? It`s bad enough that they burned in the crematoria during the Holocaust. Please, just let us save them."
My thoughts? For one, I do think it is rather presumptuous for the Mormons to do these baptisms without the consent of the families. However, I don't believe the baptism actually does anything, so it seems kinda pointless to argue against it on principle alone. I do think the Mormons are putting themselves in a poorer light than they should want, merely because they made an agreement to stop this practice, and have recently resumed it without notification. So, I object to it on the grounds that they already agreed to stop and are now violating the agreement.
As one commenter said: I cannot decide which is crazier--believing that you can baptize the dead by proxy or caring that someone else believes that.
What's your opinion on the matter?
If the family gives the ok, then there is no objection. Otherwise, its pretty harsh to say that the deceased is going to burn in Hell. Of course, I don't believe that being baptized is enough to get you into heaven so I see the practice as a little pointless. Pretty much, respect the wishes of the family.
Like what you've read? Well, then here's more:
http://www.progressiveu.org/blog/tricia0711
The only reason I would care at all is because they agreed not to. To people who beleive in it, they can only be doing good. To those who don't, it's just silly. I actually find that aspect of the mormon faith to be far less brutal, for lack of a better word, than other Christian sects' ideas about the afterlife.
"Don't blame me. I voted for Kodos."
Homer Simpson
I thought the Mormons believed in the three levels of heaven and no other option...Am I getting this confused with some other relgion or do I have miss information?
I think its could be considered steealing somebodies blessing for those that are baptised under the wrong name without the families permission. To me its all very confusing and rather nuts. I think those people need to REST in peace... I always thought that anyway to heaven had to be a personal choice and no body could be forced.
Something diffrent everyday I guess.
Love is like a box of chocolates; if you chose wisely you won’t be disappointed and have to spit it out. ~T
of people doing in the name of Jesus Christ. How do they think their behavior is helping? Isn't the whole point of the Creation story that humans have free will? If a person did not choose to be baptized in life, what makes them think they are going to change the destiny of that soul by forcing a ritual on their corpse?
I try to be respectful of all religions but the more I learn about Mormons the freakier they seem to me. I am sorry if this offends anyone, especially if you are my buddy. I just don't get you.
Scientology makes way more sense to me. The idea that aliens have possessed us and make us do bad things is more feasible in my mind.
"Consistency is not a human trait" - Maude, from Harold and Maude
Serious;y is that what scientologist believe? I never even remotely knew that.
Love is like a box of chocolates; if you chose wisely you won’t be disappointed and have to spit it out. ~T
about Tom Cruise that provides a basic 101 introduction to Scientology.
It really is a weird religion. I was reading a book about the Black Dahlia and there was a side story about a satanic cult in Los Angeles that used young women for sexual rituals, against their will. El Ron Hubbard, the founder of scientology was involved.
Just to be sure I am remembering correctly and not being slanderous, I looked him up on wikipedia, here is what it says:
"After the war, Hubbard met Jack Parsons, an aeronautics professor at Caltech and an associate of the British Intelligence occultist[49] Aleister Crowley.[50][51] Hubbard and Parsons were allegedly engaged in the practice of ritual magick in 1946, including an extended set of sex magic rituals called the Babalon Working, intended to summon a goddess or "moonchild."[52] The Church says Hubbard was working as an ONI agent on a mission to end Parsons' supposed magical activities and to "rescue" a girl Parsons was "using" for supposedly magical purposes. In a 1952 lecture series, Hubbard recommended a book of Crowley's and referred to him as "Mad Old Boy"[53][54] and as "my very good friend".[55] Hubbard later married the girl he said that he rescued from Parsons, Sara Northrup.[56] Hubbard also described Parsons as his friend in his Scientology lectures rather than a person he was investigating. Crowley recorded in his notes that he considered Hubbard a "lout" who made off with Parsons' money and girlfriend in an "ordinary confidence trick."[11][8]
Sara Northrup became Hubbard's second wife in August 1946.[57] It was an act of bigamy, as Hubbard had abandoned, but not divorced, his first wife and children as soon as he left the Navy (he divorced his first wife more than a year after he had remarried).[8] Both women allege Hubbard physically abused them. He is also alleged to have once kidnapped Sara's infant, Alexis, taking her to Cuba. Later, he disowned Alexis, claiming he was not her father and that she was actually Jack Parsons' child.[58] Sara filed for divorce in late 1950, citing that Hubbard was, unknown to her, still legally bound to his first wife at the time of their marriage. Her divorce papers also accused Hubbard of kidnapping their baby daughter Alexis, and of conducting "systematic torture, beatings, strangulations and scientific torture experiments."[59][60]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._Ron_Hubbard
"Consistency is not a human trait" - Maude, from Harold and Maude
:yikes:
:`(
Child abuse and the robbing of innocents tear me up. I can hardly believe that this represents the entire religion. I am wery that this might give a fine religion a bad name like many Pagans and Wiccans have to offer. But I guess my door is open to learning more. If this actually the case... I do not know what is wrong with people.
Love is like a box of chocolates; if you chose wisely you won’t be disappointed and have to spit it out. ~T
is about child abuse, nor does it condone it. L. Ron Hubbard's life is very rich and full with all kinds of bizarre adventures and friends. This is only one period in his life. I think he was a little Bipolar if you ask me, which I also believe to be true about Jospeh Smith.
I do think he was a bit of a genius. I am not sure if everything in my above post is actually true, but I am pretty sure about the sex rituals for the purpose of making a moon child. I read that in a book about the black dahlia, like i said.
scientology is particularly interesting because it happens to be the religion of hollywood's most successful. I think Kabbalah is a close second in Holllywood, although I have read that certain Jewish authorities strongly object to Madonna's integration of Kabbalah into her music and videos.
Hm, I am thinking I should read the book "Dianetics" just for fun.
"Consistency is not a human trait" - Maude, from Harold and Maude
Its completely a decision of an individual.He know what to choose and what not to.Well its a matter of religion i guess we being the humans of a certain religion doesnt have the right to suggest a person to choose a religion or force him.
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