I've been there and back again with religion. I grew up Christian, got sick of the church condemning me to hell every week, became athiest, felt empty, became agnostic, felt emptier, became Wiccan, liked it for five years and then got sick of it, and now I'm a Christian again. I don't imagine that I've actually changed religion, just my perceptive on it. I believe that throughout my religious journey I've only fooled myself into thinking that I wasn't tied to Christian beliefs, that I wasn't living by how God wanted me to, that I actually believed all the stuff Wicca told me. I think God sent me on that journey to gain religious tolerance, because although I'm generally considered part of a conservative group, I'm individually considered liberal. I believe this is because of the time I was part of one of the most liberal religions out there. Looking back I was a pretty mean kid. I probably would be burning my - dearly beloved - Harry Potter books without having read one page. I'd be ignorant. I'd be God fearing. God doesn't want his children to fear Him, He wants us to love Him. I don't press my religion on others and I don't agree that religion should be forced. If the Pagans are going to Hell, they don't care because they don't BELIEVE in Hell. Leave them be. With that said, I also don't agree that Pagans should generalize all Christians as hating and bible thumping. I used to and I've witnessed that it only brings more hate. Fight fire with fire and everyone gets burned. Why can't we all just get along?
There and Back Again
By marsupial13 - Posted on May 31st, 2007
I agree with you. I especially like the last few sentences; sums it up very nicely.
"What do we live for, if it is not to make life less difficult for each other?" George Elliot
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." Aristotle
"I...became athiest, felt empty, became agnostic, felt emptier,"
I think this is a very important line. Most arguments centred around religion centre around different perspectives regarding religion. I've been Agnostic most of my life, even before I knew what it was actually called. I don't view a religion's efficacy in terms of whether or not it makes me feel good. My concern lies with truth.
Many people argue the benefits of religions in regards to the solice and contentment it extends to people who buy into them. But I can't help but see it as willful delusion. If comfort is all people are after and religion offers them this, fine. But the thing is, when people then start to make claims that what they believe is the truth, it starts to piss me off.
I suppose it's like the Matrix argument; would you like to be plugged in or plugged out? Unfortunately I've been plugged out nearly my entire life, so make believe is not an option for me. Being Agnostic doesn't make me feel empty inside, largely because I genuinely believe that no man knows whether there is or is not a God. I think the only reason it would make you feel empty is because you weren't interested in truth, you were seeking comfort.
_____________________________________________________________
I am the people my mother warned me about.
First of all, thank you for your input. I value it greatly and appreciate your time taken to comment.
Second, I would like to explain why I felt emptier as an agnostic. When I denied any god existed, it wasn't as bad as not accepting the God I actually believed in. See, I believe that I was a Christian all along - a bad Christian, but I still deep down believed in Jesus Christ. When I identified myself as an agnostic, it was like I accepted that there might or might not be a higher power, but only because I was mad at God for the treatment HIS PEOPLE gave me. Understand?
Without God I have no comfort. Bottom line. So in a sense, you're right, I was seeking comfort. I was seeking the comfort of my true Savior that I had denied for so long. I was seeking truth, but I was looking in all the wrong places. I knew the truth all along, I just hated it so much that it was hard for me to accept.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Dancers are instruments, like a piano the choreographer plays." ~George Balanchine
*Tatiana Romanov
"I knew the truth all along, I just hated it so much that it was hard for me to accept."
You do realise that saying things like this to an Agnostic is like pissing in his cornflakes? Every time somebody presents belief to me as truth, it pushes me closer to starting my own cult.
_____________________________________________________________
I am the people my mother warned me about.
I didn't mean it as a truth for everyone. I meant it as my own personal truth. If you read anything I wrote in this blog or in the last reply in their entireties, they both imply that I accept another's personal beliefs and don't press my own towards them, simply because I've been there and I can see things from the others' perspective. Kindly stop selecting phrases that are offensive alone and look at the entire message.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Dancers are instruments, like a piano the choreographer plays." ~George Balanchine
*Tatiana Romanov
"If you read anything I wrote in this blog or in the last reply in their entireties, they both imply that I accept another's personal beliefs and don't press my own towards them"
I'm not suggesting you push your beliefs on people, I read the blog. You say you accept other people's beliefs but you also dismiss them as wrong. What has Christianity offered by way of tangible proof that the others lack? Other than comfort? What makes it more true, other than unsubstantiated belief?
"Kindly stop selecting phrases that are offensive alone and look at the entire message."
What? I read the entire message, it was all very nice and courteous and made all efforts to placate me by validating my comment on comfort, but then you went right ahead and started declaring your beliefs as truth.
"I was seeking truth, but I was looking in all the wrong places. I knew the truth all along, I just hated it so much that it was hard for me to accept."
Saying it's a 'personal truth' is just another way of saying a belief, except it alludes to it being more than that. If something is not a truth for everybody, then it is not the truth, it is speculation.
_____________________________________________________________
I am the people my mother warned me about.
*sigh* "What has Christianity offered by way of tangible proof that the others lack?"
That, I think, is irrelevent, considering I clarified that it was MY personal truth.
"What makes it more true, other than unsubstantiated belief?"
it makes it more true to me because it is my BELIEF. Just as agnosticism is YOUR BELIEF.
"but then you went right ahead and started declaring your beliefs as truth."
Again, they're truth to ME. It doesn't matter if they're lies or truth to anyone else. I believe that its the truth for MYSELF, but maybe not another person.
"If something is not a truth for everybody, then it is not the truth, it is speculation."
Fine then, in your words, its my speculation. You're taking this way out of perspective.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Dancers are instruments, like a piano the choreographer plays." ~George Balanchine
*Tatiana Romanov
Out of curiosity... did you look into other religions that believe in God, besides Christianity? (I don't know much about Wicca, so I'm not sure if they do or not...)
~C
Visit my blog: www.progressiveu.org/blog/mvenus929
Read the news: www.progressiveu.org/news
No I didn't. I figured that all religious people that believed in God were like the ones I had known. Keep in mind I was about 12-13 at that time. Wicca is a subsect of Paganism, so they believe in balance betweeen a male god and a female goddess, reincarnation, and celebrate the beauty of the earth. VERY different from any Christian religion.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Dancers are instruments, like a piano the choreographer plays." ~George Balanchine
*Tatiana Romanov
I find it very interesting that you chose the exact polar opposite of religions to try out when you decided that Christianity isn't for you. Did you really mean ALL of Christianity as not applealing to you personally? If so, choosing wicca would make sense.
Where are you now in terms of religion? What things about Christianty do not appeal to you? I am interested to know.
For the most part it was mostly the people I had come into contact with. I grew up without a father until I was about 11 so, although my mom had a high status at church, she was looked down upon because of me. I didn't like that. At all. So it turned me off a lot when other things popped up that were 'disapproved'. I love the morals Christianity stands for but I hate how some people enforce them. I also hate how Christians are given bad names and its widely accepted that when we talk about our faith, we're trying to force something *ahem*... Anyway, I'm not a conservative Christian now but I don't agree with everything the Bible tells me. I don't agree that homosexuals are in the wrong, for instance, and I never will. It varies on issues and its common for everyone in any religion to not agree with something at one time or another. Thanks for your curiosity! I love talking about this for some reason...I think any religion is interesting and its great to share about my own journey!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Dancers are instruments, like a piano the choreographer plays." ~George Balanchine
*Tatiana Romanov