I have heard a that many denomonations in the Christain Community don't believe that the Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter-Day Saints is Christain? Why not? Is it because we believe In God the Eternal Father, and in his Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost? It is because we believe that we were created in our Father's image? I want to try to clear up some confusion here, both on my part, and on the part of the rest of the Christain Community. I don't know everything, but wouldn't mind a civilized discussion about similarities and differences of beliefs. Please give me your thoughts on the matter.
We believe that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of the Father. That his mission on Earth was to bring about the Salvation of mankind. He is our savior and the Head of our Church. Under Him, the current Prophet and the Twelve apostles guide and direct His Church. I know that Joseph Smith was the Prophet of the Restoration. We do not worship him, but through him the fullness of the everlasting gospel was restored on the Earth. The Book of Mormon is another Testament of Jesus Christ, and it contains the fulness of the Everlasting gospel. It is a witness of the divinity of the work, speaking of Christ's followers in ancient America, and his visit to the America's after his death and ressurection. His resurrection from the dead brings to pass the ressurection of all men. This means that all men will be restored to a perfect immortal body when they are ressurected. I highly suggest reading the Articles of Fath, a quick summary of the tenents of my faith, before you respond.
Try to go to http://scriptures.lds.org/en/a_of_f/1
What about the Most important Doctrine in the bible: the Trinity! Without that the whole bible would be false. There would be no salvation. There seems to be some attempt to water down the mormon relgion, in an attempt to blend in with the rest of the mormon religion. Please, tell me when Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, did he not do exaclty what John warned against in revelation when he said, "If anyone adds anything to what is written here, God will add to that person the plagues described in this book" NLT Rev. 22:18.
"It's Better To Burn Out Than To Fade Away" -Neil Young
...in the christian community on the exact nature of "the Trinity," abd the Mormons certainly aren't the only non-trinitarian christian sect out there. For example, most Unitarian sects reject the concept of "the Trinity," along with the Church of God, the Seventh Day Adventists, the Jehovah's Witnesses, and the Oneness Pentecostals (just to name a few).
My favorite quote about "the Trinity" comes from (not surprisingly) Thomas Jefferson...
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. Ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity. It is the mere Abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of Jesus. ~ Thomas Jefferson, letter to Francis Adrian Van der Kemp (1816)
percivale
-------------------------
"Vi Veri Vniversum Vivus Vici." ~ V.
I don't understand why people have such a hard time believing the Book of Mormon. It's just a journal of a different people, just like the Bible is a journal of matthew, luke, ruth...the list goes on. why is it hard to think that there were people somewhere else in the world keeping a record of their family, and happenings with their people?
We must define our terms...
When an LDS says God the Eternal Father, and in his Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost, you mean three separate gods.
When Christians say God the Eternal Father, and in his Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost, we mean the Trinity, one true and living God in Nature, Being, etc...
When an LDS says created in our Father's image? They mean, as God once was man may become, as God is man may become.
When Christians says created in our Father's image? We have the ability to reason, make choices and do our will, not that we do the right thing, but this separates us from the rest of creation.
When an LDS say we believe that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of the Father, he was begotten physically by the Father God.
"Jesus, our elder brother was begotten in the flesh by the same character that was in the Garden of Eden, and who is our Heavenly Father" Journal of Discourses 1:51
...Christ was begotten by an Immortal Father in the same way that mortal men are begotten by mortal fathers.
Mormon Doctrine page 547
CHRIST WAS NOT BEGOTTEN BY THE HOLY GHOST, ... Christ was begotten of God, he was not born without the aid of Man and that Man was God!
Doctrines of Salvation 1:18
When Christians says we believe that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of the Father, he has preeminance over all creation, he is God's only Son by Nature, as Christians we are sons or daughter by adoption through Christ's finished work on the Cross and no acts or works we do save us or impress God toward our Salvation.
If you want I will dig up all the LDS material for what I posted, but I figured I would post that as it was the most questionable or unknown by most modern Mormons.
j.
"you mean three separate gods." I don't know how many times I have to tell you, God is the only God. The holy Ghost is NOT a God, therefore there aren't 3 gods.
for some reason you keep puting in what you think we believe instead of what we really do believe.
Well if you are truly Monotheist you might want to look into the History of the LDS Church a little deaper.
j.
Have you ever read the book of mormon? you seem to think that you know everything about the LDS religion, but I'm not sure that all that is in your head is correct.
Yes I have, not to the extent I have read the Bible. I prayed the prayer and did not receive the Testimony.
I never claimed to know anything or everything about the LDS, you are claiming these things, but I have read Doctrine & Covanants, Pearl of Great Price, History of the Church, etc. and have found what the LDS church does truly believe. ie: As God is man may become, as man is God once was. So I guess I claim to know that...
j.
did you ask in faith, with nothing weivering?
Yes, I do everything by faith, I have had to live my last year by faith, I had a car accident that left my one friend dead, another with a broken pelvis, the driver with scraps and a broken shoulder and broken ribs for myself, God provided for me daily, not always as I wanted, but always as I need, this lasted close to 7-8 months as I couldn't work and for the first month and a half I could barely take care of myself, my sister to my aid! There are so many little details, not getting my insurance monies for almost for months, we pray about it at a Bible study then two days later my Lawyer call and tells me I can pick it up. So yes I know what asking in faith is and living by faith is as well.
j.
Hey erase,
Had no idea you went through such conflict. It's important to tell our friend here that you prayed to Jesus for strength throughout this entire ordeal. As it was through him you gained your blessings and strength to make it through. Through faith is one thing, but through Jesus is another.
I have had a similar story where Jesus turned my life around as a down and out teenager at 19 when a friend of mine was accidentally killed by a gun. From the moment I was saved, I was blessed in ways I couldn't have imagined. The road has been tough to say the least, but even through the rough times I still can't get this smile off of my face.
Sorry, so be a tad clearer, when I mean faith, I mean faith directly in Christ, what his has done for me, and him supplying for all my needs, I prayed to Jesus because that's all I had and he showed himself to be true. All I can say is, he is the Creator of the Universe, the one true and living God, Saviour of my soul, well Saviour to all who are willing to come to the Cross of Calvary for forgiveness. As Paul said "I preach Christ and him crucified" if I could reach that mark I would be content, but I strive, I strive.
j.
Well there's a few differences in why regular Christians do not believe Mormon's to be Christians. But I just want to discuss this theory on a logic level.
"If all Mormons are Christians, then all Christians must be Mormons..."
But the church does not believe this obviously, so their logic is flawed. Christians believe that...
"Mormons are not Christians, therefore Christians cannot be Mormons."
It is this simple explanation of logic which makes more sense.
Now regarding beliefs, Christians do believe something quite different than Mormons. Although you use the same terms, your definitions vary greatly. But the main difference is this. Christians are God fearing people, Mormons are God aspiring.
Christians believe that we are saved through Jesus Christs blood, and that our faith in him produces good works as they are spiritually reborn upon accepting him as their Lord and Savior.
Mormons believe that Jesus died to atone for Adam's sins, and that man must work his way back to God.
Christian's believe that God was the spirit, the truth, and the word, and Jesus was the word in flesh, or God himself. Jesus even said in the Bible that my father and I are one. Although there is no references to the trinity within the Bible, there is more support of the Godhead being one, than three.
Mormons believe that Jesus, God, are two separate beings.
Aside from this, all of the works needed to get into heaven, or what Mormons call the plan of eternal salvation, are not practiced by Christians. Such as wearing of the sacred underwear, learning secret handshakes, temple marriage, sealing of families, obtaining a temple recommend. These things are not practiced by Christians, but are actually practiced by Masons and Wicans.
So which one is right. Who really know. But their beliefs are different. I believe thought that Christians are Christians, and Mormons are Mormons. Mormons beliefs are VERY different from Christian beliefs and have literally nothing in common. The LDS church though will use a lot of similar terms to fool Christians, such as Jesus, or the world Salvation. But they don't mean the same thing. Such as when you say Jesus, you mean, son of Heavenly Father, brother of Jesus, who lived on the planet kolab, a man who became a God and set forth his plan of eternal progression. And when you say salvation, you mean laws of eternal progression, where a spirit child must get a body, be tempted, baptized, obtain a temple recommend, sealed in temple marriage, tithe, to become a God like Jesus. From my point of view it looks as though Mormons have taken Christian terms and hijacked them.
That's basically why man Christians have problems with Mormons calling themselves Christians.
One last note. Christians also believe that Lucifer was kicked out of Heaven for wanting to become God. Mormons believe they want to become a God. Mormons deny the blood of Christ when it comes to communion, and are urged not to have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Now if you don't pray to Jesus, pray in his name, or deny the blood he shed so that you don't have to be sacrificing cows every sunday to be forgiven of your sins, biblically, you cannot call yourself Christian.
Well, there's a rather big difference between the book of Mormon and the Bible. The bible was a collection of 50 plus authors from different walks of life, from kings, to slaves, to disciples, which was written over the course of 1200 years. Many of these authors did not know each other, and their stories still made sense....The amazing thing is that old testament is prophetic to what was written in New Testament.
The Book of Mormon on the other hand was written by one Author alone. Joseph Smith. And what is taught in the Book of Mormon contradicts the Bible, or 1200 years of teachings.
Here are some other facts regarding the book of Mormon which make it difficult to believe:
-In 1828, eight years after he supposedly had been told by God himself to join no church, Smith applied for membership in a local Methodist church. Other members of his family had joined the Presbyterians. Why would he do this is LDS faith was the only true church?
-The detailed history and civilization described in the Book of Mormon does not correspond to anything found by archaeologists anywhere in the Americas. The Book of Mormon describes a civilization lasting for a thousand years, covering both North and South America, which was familiar with horses, elephants, cattle, sheep, wheat, barley, steel, wheeled vehicles, shipbuilding, sails, coins, and other elements of Old World culture. But no trace of any of these supposedly very common things has ever been found in the Americas of that period. Nor does the Book of Mormon mention many of the features of the civilizations which really did exist at that time in the Americas. The LDS church has spent millions of dollars over many years trying to prove through archaeological research that the Book of Mormon is an accurate historical record, but they have failed to produce any convincing pre-columbian archeological evidence supporting the Book of Mormon story. In addition, whereas the Book of Mormon presents the picture of a relatively homogeneous people, with a single language and communication between distant parts of the Americas, the pre-columbian history of the Americas shows the opposite: widely disparate racial types (almost entirely east Asian - definitely not Semitic, as proven by recent DNA studies), and many unrelated native languages, none of which are even remotely related to Hebrew or Egyptian.
-The people of the Book of Mormon were supposedly devout Jews observing the Law of Moses, but in the Book of Mormon there is almost no trace of their observance of Mosaic law or even an accurate knowledge of it
-Many of the basic historical notions found in the Book of Mormon had appeared in print already in 1825, just two years before Smith began producing the Book of Mormon, in a book called View of the Hebrews, by Ethan Smith (no relation) and published just a few miles from where Joseph Smith lived. A careful study of this obscure book led one LDS church official (the historian B. H. Roberts, 1857-1933) to confess that the evidence tended to show that the Book of Mormon was not an ancient record, but concocted by Joseph Smith himself, based on ideas he had read in the earlier book.
These are just a few things why people have a difficult time believing in the book of mormon
Hi Amy,
I almost became a mormon when I went through all these turmoils. About half my family here is Mormon, and they sent missionaries the minute they found out about my tragedy. At that moment, I was looking for any answers. I held that Book of Mormon in my hand, prayed for meaning in my life, for it to be true, and I did not receive that burning bosom so many mormons talk about . Still looking for answers, I wasn't that happy in life, uneducated, down and out, until I found Jesus in a parking lot in Starbucks. From that moment on, something switched on. Suddenly I became this great businessman, my moral compass was alive again, I had a humor, I had laughter, life has been good since then. I'm 30 now and I still haven't stopped smiling since that day in that parking lot.
Cool cartoon.....
Check this out......well made. My uncle and aunt saw it..they say this is exactly what Mormons believe, or believed. The younger generation though has been taught something watered down. But this is basically it. Cartoon was banned by the church. They have the Adam-God doctrine in here, and a lot of stuff that other prophets taught. Amazing... This truly isn't Christianity.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=zy0d1HbItOo