Have you been keeping up with this Polygamous Cults? Stationed in Colorado, Texas and Utah? If you haven't heard 437 boys and girls from polygamous cults have been taken into protective care, and soon being put into foster care. These children were raised in horrible environments. Being pulled out of school in sixth grade, and not told to work--their only job was to bear children, and please their "husband". Within these proximities was possible sexual abuse, and obviously brainwashing. The polygamousists in these cults were told that by being apart of this group they were to be closer to God. (Another religion that's ruining human morales). And if you do anything against the prophet or church the only way to get to heaven would be by killing yourself, or being killed by the head leader. This is America?! In 2008? WOW. This is surreal, I have no idea how this is still going on in the world today. These ladies have never cut their hair, have never been independant--they look like they Prarie women. I feel like these disgusting old men created this wack-religion to be able to sexual mistreat and abuse women. Such as Warren Jeffs (who is looked up as God by these people) and— who was convicted in September of rape as an accomplice for forcing an underage girl to marry her adult cousin — has directed the affairs of the Fundamentalist LDS Church since 2003, following the death of his father, Rulon Jeffs. Brian Hales states "The tendency of polygamy ... is to create narcissists of men and co-dependents of women. It's a very fertile field for sexual exploitation and perversion. Beds in the temple ... there's a tendency to exalt the man. If he doesn't get what he wants from wife one, you can see him going to wife two."
My Question: Is it right that the "evil" outsiders took these poly-children out of their homes and into foster care? You see and hear these polygamist mothers crying and pleading for their children because the outside world is "taking away their purity and virtue". Thes mothers probably don't have a chance in seeing their kids ever again because they are locked in these sectors from the outside world and now that these kids are gone they are deemed evil. How are these grown children (late teens?) supposed to survive in the corporate world? Just being thrown into this world. They have no clue about cell phones, movies, and how to get a carrer, since they are thrown out of school by 6th grade. They don't stand a chance. Obviously, it's a good decision to get these children out of these Sects and out of the sexual abuse. But, I believe they should ease these children into the world slowly. I have no idea how these children are going to fit in with their adoptive families it's concerning. But wow. What a world. It's like the Twlight Zone, who knew that any of this inhumane act was going on? I'm shocked, and appalled at what I've seen as of yet.
Thoughts?
I don't like how some people that were from these communities act like it was good for them. I feel like they were brainwashed so much that they actually believe it was okay to be treated like that. It is so sad that some of these children have no choice about their lifestyle. Especially how you said it was 2008... I could expect something like this many many years ago, but it seems like this does not fit in with the time. I like to be "free" as Americans seem to call it, but when is that going too far? I think the law should be more strict with these issues. Like on Oprah, there was the polygamist community. Why should these things be allowed? People are naive to believe that horrible things are not going on in those communities.
I do agree that a lot of ti seems skeevy, but a lot of the women on the show were sincerely happy with their lifestyle and loved their husband and children. I think polygamy can be the right decision for some people. Sometimes it's just natural like someone's sex or decision NOT to get married. It's when people take a good thing that works for some people and tries to enforce it on others. Then it gets out of control and oversteps boundaries.
Times flies like the wind; fruit flies like a banana.
Honestly, I really don't have a problem with polygamy. The sect also stated that there were rarely girls under 18 married, I can't remember where I heard that but if you want a source I'll find it. They choose to live that way, they seems to be happy and that is their belief.
I mean think about how many children are raped and abused by "normal" families. People need to leave them alone and stop being so nosy.
Après la pluie le beau temps. ♥
Check out my latest blog! :]
You don't have a problem with polygamy? Wow. So you're fine with your husband, or boyfriend cheating on you and then having a crazy blood line of relatives? I don't think we are being nosy, we are concerned for the saftey of these children...These people are content with their life styles only because they are so brainwashed and used to this atmosphere. They are happy because they are beaten to the point where they HAVE to be happy or else they get in trouble. These people have perfect manners etc, because they are beaten into being perfect people. True--children are raped and abused by "normal" families but these sects allow these men get away with rpae.
Where are you getting this information, if you could provide where you found the fact that they are all beaten that'd be great.
Also, to them it is NOT cheating. It is a way to get into Heaven. They accept that lifestyle and cherish it. You only see the one side from the news, and may I say that it is BIAS because the news sides with what our society thinks, which is that Polygamy is wrong. I am not saying this is for me though, and neither is Christianity, Buddhism, Judaism, etc. Just because you don't agree with something does not mean you have to bash them.
Après la pluie le beau temps. ♥
Check out my latest blog! :]
It sounds like you don't have a problem with polygamy, but a problem with this religion. True polygamy isn't cheating because all parties are consenting adults. They are not abusers, rapists, or manipulators. In this case, the people who are abusers and manipulators are using forced polygamy to meed their own wants. Real polygamy isn't like this, and I see nothing wrong with it either.
Click here to read about new ways to save money and the environment that you have never heard!
I'm a live and let live type of person right up until somebody asks me to pick up the tab for their alternative lifestyle.
There is a reason why society places a preference on two parent monogamous households and it is because that is what makes sense economically. It takes two adults working (not both necessarily wage paying jobs) to support a family.
Our welfare roles are filled with single Moms. And polygamous families also place heavy demands on welfare and foodstamps. It is a rare father that can earn enough to support all the children that he can sire with multiple women. I'll bet every one of these kids in that cult was signed up on WIC and that all the mothers are drawing foodstamps.
Now THAT is a new and different way of looking at it. I never thought about that though, maybe you could find some stats or articles about it? I'd like to learn more.
Après la pluie le beau temps. ♥
Check out my latest blog! :]
As you requested, here are some articles. The key to understanding this is that the multiple wives of a polygimist are technically single mothers because they are not LEGALLY married. Our welfare systems are quite generous with single mothers and when one has 13 kids they get a nice check and a lot of foodstamps and WIC assistance.
Who do you think pockets the money? Do you think the women are controlling the purse strings? A polygamist with a stable full of wives makes a pretty nice living by keeping them barefoot and pregnant. They are more than just sex slaves. They are economic slaves too.
Who Foots Bill For Polygamist Communities?
Government money and public funds pay for polygamy
Wow that is crazy. I really never thought about it from the economic perspective. I don't care what they do, but when it affects all the single mothers out there that aren't abusing the system, I do not agree with it at all.
Après la pluie le beau temps. ♥
Check out my latest blog! :]
So many on this forum are really young and seem to think that the Treasury is a bottomless well of money.
I hope that when you get a little older that you are highly successful in whatever career you choose and that you earn a good living. When you reach that point, and when that you realize that a huge percentage of your paycheck is confiscated by the Feds and that when you get done paying taxes to the State and then getting taxed on top of taxes with sales taxes and then getting massively nickle and dimed with a multitude of fees like on your phone bill and your license plates you'll start to look at things from that perspective more often.
Nothing is free. Some things that the government pays for are worth it and a lot isn't. There is always far too much waste and fraud.
And then there are things like this where one branch of the government is paying to support a lifestlye that another branch of the government has deemed a crime.
Really interesting point of view, I never thought of it from that point of view either. I've gotten a lot of information from the Associated Press, and I hate to admit it--but Dr.Phil has run a special yesterday and today he will be running one at 3pm Pacific/Standard time.
That welfare thing is really the only negative I see too. Although I still don't that's a good reason to take people's kids away or force people to not be polygamous. if that were the case, we could just stop unmarried people from having sex.
“I hope the departure is joyful and I hope never to return.” - Frida Kahlo
I'm gonna betch slap the dumb outta you
Being polygamous is not something these people need to stop. If their willing and happy to live their lives like that, then thats their choice.
When it becomes wrong is when they force it upon their children. This children were never given a choice in all this. They probably didnt even know there were other choices out there.
Whats the worst is these sick people used all this a an excuse to sexually abuse children
So dont bash them for being polygamous. Bash them for their sick decision to abuse their innocent children.
I wish people could separate the two.
“I hope the departure is joyful and I hope never to return.” - Frida Kahlo
I'm gonna betch slap the dumb outta you
Yes, I thoroughly agree that spectators need to seperate the two cases. Watching the news today, I hear the children are just saying that they "want their moms". It's quite sad that these children are confused and have no idea that where they were growing up was "wrong". The protective services did not take the children out of the environment because they didn't approve of the polygamy, they took the children out because of the reasonable cause of possible sexual abuse, and the poor living conditions. The mayor of (whatever city this is taken place in) in Texas said that he didn't know that a Polygamus camp was being set up in the city, because the leader said he was setting up retreats for business people to go and relax to. (I can find a source...) and also, these children are homeschooled. Therefore, being educated by the people of this town who probably don't have the proper backround to be teaching these kids, and as I stated in the original blog that they take students out of the school system by 6th grade. The need for an education is very important, and now that they are out of the camp they have to make up for schooling. I think these mothers need to have their children back, but my concern is these women view men as gods, and can't quite survive on their own. It's quite a culture shock to go from that 18th century prarie town to the craziness of the 21st century. There IS sexual abuse going on in those sects. But it isn't possible to lock up these men for doing what they are doing because it's part of their religion.
Is polygamy illegal?
I think it is illegal... But the marriages are not lawful marriages, they are marriages by their church and are marriages in the eyes of God.
Après la pluie le beau temps. ♥
Check out my latest blog! :]
Polygamy is illegal actually. Which I think is dumb, not all polygamists are religious people excluding themselves from society. Although I'm sure that has nothing to do with why it's illegal.
“I hope the departure is joyful and I hope never to return.” - Frida Kahlo
I'm gonna betch slap the dumb outta you
I suppose that Bill Gates, Warren Buffet and a few other people who represent a very small percentage of our population could afford to have multiple wives and support the large number of children that would issue forth from their harem. I suppose it is no accident that in societies where polygamy was accepted it was usually the very rich and the royalty that had harems.
But mostly it is a fact that polygamy is a lifestyle where the costs will be shifted through our welfare system from the people who engage in it to the people who for the most part don't even approve of it . Why should taxpayers be forced to fund a lifestyle they don't approve of?
I suppose my concern could be addressed by barring polygamists from the welfare system. I could live with that. But then it would raise the concern that we are punishing the innocent children who had no choice in the matter and were being made to suffer poverty because of the ill-advised choices of the parents. My answer to that would be to quit incentizing ALL single women to have babies outside the bonds of a two-person union but I doubt I could get the liberals to agree.
I therefore think it is better to keep polygamy illegal so that there are less of those children from that I am taxed to support.
It is easier to get people to agree to banning polygamy then it is to get them to agree to make single women take financial responsibility for their own poor decisions to bring children into the world that they can't afford to feed, clothe and shelter.
If I didn't have to pay the bill I would not have any problem with polygamy or single-motherhood because I am a live and let live sort of person. But since the liberals have made me financially responsible for other people's poor choices, then I feel like I will insist on having a say in the matter.
I agree and disagree. While I do think that is an economically sound reason to want polygamy to stay illegal, I don't think paying for polygamy is so bad. I have to pay for capital punishment, abortions, war, all manner of evil. So polygamy isn't something that I really think would bother me.
“I hope the departure is joyful and I hope never to return.” - Frida Kahlo
I'm gonna betch slap the dumb outta you
So essentially you are arguing that since the world is already evil that it is OK for it to get more evil?
Seems like moral relativism to me. I guess I am a conservative because I want to conserve what is good about America and stop the downwards spiral of our society.
...would be "on what constitutional grounds do you justify interfering in the personal relationship choices of other citizens?" Lots of people have opinions that disapprove of the way that other people live. But that doesn't mean that there is a compelling interest that would justify the State making a particular arrangement illegal. I mean, let's be frank...polygamy isn't illegal in this country because of its potential economic impact on the welfare system. Polygamy is illegal primarily because of religiously-motivated objections to the practice, though that argument is often obscured behind the history of sexual and social abuse that has followed the practice in the context of our nation's history.
There are lots of family arrangements that some (even most) citizens find to be socially unacceptable. For example, there are many who would say (and have said) that interracial marriages are part of the very "downward spiral" of our society (which is itself purely a matter of opinion). Do you think that arguments of this type have merit? The questions that we need to ask, are "what are the legitimate concerns of the State, if any, that justify the total prohibition of the practice of multiple marriage" and "are those concerns constiutionally justifiable?"
Do you think it is fair to judge a form of family relationship based only on what happens when the arrangement "fails?" I mean, yes...a poor polygamous family probably won't be able to support itself, and may very well end up on welfare. But, isn't that what happens to poor monogomous families, too? Does the fact that "the rest of us" have to foot the bill for poor monogomous families mean that monogomy is a socially inadviseable form of family relationship? What about the families that don't end up on welfare? As it was mentioned above, there are examples of societies that did in fact permit polygamous relationships, that seem to have been sucessful for at least some of those families (albeit the more wealthy ones).
More to the point, is there something inherent to a polygamous relationship that would violate the rights of any other citizens, or does that infringement only occur when some other factor is introduced (such as abuse, poverty or religious objection)?
Just a point to consider...
Blackout
-------------------------
Yes, I've changed my username from "percivale" to "Blackout." Go here if you want to know why.
Evil? Exaggerate much?
My thoughts were jumbled. What I essentially meant is the problem is not polygamy, it is welfare. If that's your only problem with polygamy then I don't think that's a good enough argument. You should be against welfare. I just wanted to point out that people are forced to pay for far worse things.
Downward spiral is relative. I agree but it's probably for different reasons.
“I hope the departure is joyful and I hope never to return.” - Frida Kahlo
I'm gonna betch slap the dumb outta you
I don't see how polygamy would be causing a "downwards spiral of our society". Our society will still remain intact and upward if some people have more than one spouse.
Click here to read about new ways to save money and the environment that you have never heard!