"Go back to where you came from" or " Your no real American" are phrases I hear muttered constantly, mostly by white Americans.
“The Senate failed to reach a compromise on immigration legislation, which
would have allowed illegal immigrants who have been in the U.S. longer than
five years to remain, while those who have been here between two years and
five years would have to leave, but could return as guest workers. And
immigrants here less than two years will be right back with your entrees.”
-Tina Fey
These statements have been made more because of appearance than legal citizenship. For example, "Asian Americans", "Hispanic Americans"," African Americans" etc, who are born in the United States of America, are given the title of "American"as some sort of contingency prize. The only true "Americans" are Native Americans, which I find very ironic. The United States of America was stolen from its original inhabitors. Which means "White Americans" should be called European Americans, Caucasian Americans or something of that nature.
I completely understand the issues that coincide with immigration and citizenship, such a job security, outsourcing, etc. But I am strictly addressing the issue of how the USA categorizes their citizens with titles (politically correct...give me a break)
Do Americans, white include, have the right to call anyone an illegal alien when we ourselves are the true illegal aliens?
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...be my best friend?
I agree with what you're saying. Considering that when the Pilgrams came in 1620, weren't they the aliens?
People seem to forget that. A lot.
Great point...I was wondering if anyone would make that connection
Umm...no, not really. There was no established nation where the Pilgrims settled. Since there was no nation (the nearest one did not have boundries drawn as they didn't "own" land), they weren't aliens. They were foreigners, but that's not important.
And if you want to argue that the Indians were here first, I'll call bullshit once more. MOST likely, we all came from Africa/Middle East and just wandered our way across the globe. The Bering Strait used to be frozen pretty solidly, allowing for a land bridge. The "Indians" walked from Russia though Alaska and Canada through the US and spread from there, probably chasing game.
This puts humans in all the nations they need to be in for modern history to start. As most scientists agree on African-Origin, it just so happens that there are no aliens before there are set boundries for nations. Just as it was when the pilgrims and the Indians landed in the States.
Nicholas Aden
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It's great that you can cut and paste...... does this mean that you of African decent? And if so maybe the term Americans shouldn't even exist.
What did I copy and paste?
I put my hat in the ring that says we all descended from common ancestors...It's not like it bugs me. I mean, I've got relations to some of the most racist people in history (some uncle of mine was a Grand Dragon for the KKK and WAY WAY WAY down the line I share a cousin of some sorts with Hitler).
But you've missed the point. And it's just not worth my time to explain it to you.
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what a big surprise.....hahaha I would have never made the connetion of those organizations with you. Dare I say again HA
There was no established nation where the Pilgrims settled.
Iroquois Confederacy
-- quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
You know what I meant. >.<
And the nations of "primatives" at that point were not recognized by "civilized" man and thus were null and void at the time of entry.
Also, the Iroquois were a confederacy, or a loose bunch of states that promise (mostly) to not go to war with the others. Effectively. They had only natural borders and did not define land and nations like the Europeans.
PLUS, the Pilgrims came here not to work, but to escape. They didn't send money back, they just wanted to start a little land of their own and keep to themselves, mostly.
If the mexicans (and any other aliens) want a patch of land to settle, I say: "New Mexico is mostly empty. You have have plots of land that you can settle there."
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Also, the Iroquois were a confederacy, or a loose bunch of states that promise (mostly) to not go to war with the others.
They were the strongest group of tribes in the Great Lakes region. The only reason they couldn't win against the Europeans was because they were outnumbered and out gunned (ie - gunpowder vs bows, you do the math). The Indians in general were half the reason for the outcomes of both the French and Indian War and the Revolution. And the American Constitution is loosely based on the the Iroquois Constitution.
And the nations of "primatives" at that point were not recognized by "civilized" man and thus were null and void at the time of entry.
It's going to be interesting if/when a more "civilized" people decide to come "settle" our land and decide that our nations aren't recognized and are therefore null and void. Will they have the right to come in and enslave or kill us?
-- quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
It's going to be interesting if/when a more "civilized" people decide to come "settle" our land and decide that our nations aren't recognized and are therefore null and void.
Maybe you've missed the fact that President Calderon of Mexico has been touring the USA for the last couple of weeks and wherever he meets with groups of illegal immigrants who have broken our laws he calls them "heros". And he has also stated that "wherever there is a Mexican, there is Mexico". He has pretty much declared that our borders, our claim to territory and our laws are null and void.
The difference is that we have the ability to wipe Mexico off the face of the Earth. I'm talking a more civilized people as a group more advanced that will outnumber and outgun us the same way we've done with the Native Americans.
-- quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Like Aliens(the extraterrestrial kind)?
Possibly. There's also the chance of us creating robots and lose control of them, or androids or other forms of genetically modified people. Though my money's on either the aliens (different culture) or robots (don't understand the irrationality of humans).
-- quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Well, I seemed to have forgotten about the migration from Africa. I probably would have never thought about that concept.
Thanks for correcting me.
Human beings evolved in Africa There is no such thing as a true native American. The aboriginal inhabitants that proceeded the Europeans to the New World got here first but they also were migrants. We are no more illegal than they are. And further, note that we give the children of illegal immigrants birthright citizenship. They are not considered illegal. Almost all whites in the USA were born on American soil and have as much birthright as anybody else.
The aboriginal American's mistake was that they failed to adequately defend their borders. It is one thing to claim territory and it is another thing to hold it. Holding territory often takes force of will and sometimes the willingness to fight. They got invaded and ultimately conquered. While they really did not embrace the idea of landownership per se, they fully understood the concept of tribal territory and they had been invading and conquering each other since long before the white man did it to them. Our arrival was just a new chapter in this ongoing history of warfare and conquest and in this particular instance they got the worst of it. To their credit, they put up a spirited fight but they were outnumbered and outgunned.
As a result of this conquest, the United States now exists as a nation with defined territorial boundaries. Like every other nation in history, just as the aboriginal Americans did, we have the right to defend our territory and define our laws. Included in these laws are our immigration laws. It is up to us to define and enforce our immigration policies ..... or not. If we choose not to defend our territory and enforce our laws, well then we will not be the first nation that dissappears into the ash bin of history.
Interestingly, many if not most of the people from the countries South of us have European blood in their veins to one extent or another. Some, like Vincete Fox have no Indian blood. Many Mexicans consider themselves to be white and prejudice against people with even a slightly darker tone of skin is an engrained feature in their society. Most Mexicans want to marry somebody at least as light skinned as themselves. There migration is in a sense just a continuation of the historic contest for territory between English and Spanish imperialism. We can yield our territory to them or fight for it.
So the answer to your question is yes. Like every other nation in history, by right of conquest ,we get to make the rules including calling anybody who enters our territory without our permission: "illegal". Like every other nation in history, we must by force of will hold onto our territory. If we fail to hold our territory, then the peoples who succeed us, who might include our descendents assimulated with their conquerors, get to make the new rules. But for now, we make the rules.
The fact that we don't have the right to tell someone if they have "birth rights" or not is beyond the point.... My question is for the people who do have legal citizenship and are still looked at as illegal aliens, are they suffering an injustice?
For those who say Native Americans immigrated too. The difference is the Native Americans did not murder rape and steal the lands from the inhabitants.
No, but they did Muder, Rape, and Steal from the White man. On several noted occasions. Indians are not all peaceful.
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what did they steal that wasn't theirs in the firt place. "Fair exchange ain't no robbery"-A wise person
March 22, 1622 - Indian attacks kill 33.3333% of Europeans in Virginia.
Justify that. Then I'll give you more to justify.
Point and fact: US citizens aren't murdering the Illegals. They, however, are killing a good amount of US citizens.
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American citizens also kill American citizens...You make it sound like before "illegals" murder didn't exist in this country. PS those "indians" were probably defending themselves.
They weren't defending themselves.
Now, I don't know the context of Nemattanew's murder, but I think we can assume that it wasn't just defense because of ONE incident.
And I didn't imply that muder didn't exist. You infered that because you want to make the the enemy and try and paint me in a bad light and IMPLY that I am a racist. So you know what? I am. I am a racist. I hate white folks. I think the blue-eyed devil should be removed from this great nation!
Now, got anything else?
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Just wanted to say thanks for the comments and I can smell the cow pies your cooking and trying to sell. fyi i dont want them! ;)
The first ones over the bridge found empty territory which they settled and populated. And as they split into tribes they warred on each other constantly. And there was doubtless more than one wave of migrants over the land bridge and these people warred on the people that were already there. There was a REASON why they called their men-folk "warriors". For many tribes, their entire culture was organized around this facet of life. And there was a reason why certain indians chose to build their homes in cliffs. Those were defensive positions.
Long before Europeans began settling in America, the History of the so-called native Americans was of war, rape, theft, slavery, human sacrifice and conquest of the lands of their neighbors.
And there was plenty of racism and hatred too. I live in Wyoming and am fairly familiar with the tribes here and in the surrounding states. The various Sioux tribes hate each other more than they hate the white man. And it seem all indian tribes hate the Crow.
Europeans did not introduce anything new except much better technology, a much more sophisticated understanding of warfare and some germs to which the aboriginal Americans had no immunity. Of course, at the time, the Europeans had no understanding of germs so while it was a sad thing that wreaked havoc on the natives to the advantage of the Europeans, it was not like a deliberate act of extermination.
First of all, Native Americans did war among themselves. No race on earth is truly free of violence in its history. Second of all, the everyone descended from Africa theory is not feasible. There is evidence of far older human habitation in northern Europe. Also, the Native American's dna matches the dna found in Asia. The issue of illegal aliens has to do with following American law when entering the country, not where your ancestors are descended from. If an American was to take up residence in Mexico, he or she would be required to follow the Mexican laws for getting citizenship. There is nothing wrong with expecting someone taking up residence in America to do it legally.
Everyone evolving from Africa makes perfect sense. It was the perfect environment! It's believed that if the Crationism people are to be believed, Eden is somewhere in Mesopotamia! And you claim facts with no proof. If you've got proof of human habitation in Europe before the map (see above) says, then show us!
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"White Americans: The real illegal aliens"
Everybody should close their eyes and contemplate the racism that is implicit in the title to this post!
What about Asians? They all came as immigrants. What about blacks? Most of them were brought against their will so perhaps don't share in the imagined transgression. However, a very substantial minority of blacks in America are immigrants. What about middle easterners? Sometimes semetic people are considered white and sometimes not.
And plenty of these people of all races, colors and ethnicities are upset about illegal immigration. Even a lot of Hispanics are upset about illegal immigration.
Why are whites singled out in this thread?
Europeans have been on the North American continent since not long after Columbus found it; at least 500 years. The Pilgrims were johnny come lateleys. At 20 years per generation, that translates to 25 generations. In many cases they have intermarried and reproduced with the aboriginal people. In many cases they have not. A lot of white people don't even know from which European stock they descend.It is ridiculous and hateful to imply that somebody, just because they are white, is an illegal alien.
But there are quite a lot of white illegal aliens. There are about 100,000 illegal Irish and quite a lot of eastern European and middle eastern illegal aliens. What makes them illegal is not the color of their skin but rather the fact that they broke the law.
Why does everything have to be about race with some people?
Maybe I was not clear enough with my question or people aren't paying attention to the content of the blog. I am refering to people who are American citizens but are denied this title because of their physical features. As far as the title goes..it's engaing and thought provoking.
"Go back to where you came from" or " Your no real American" are phrases I hear muttered constantly, mostly by white Americans. Mostly being the operative word.
My posts have been responsive to the title of the post and the concluding question in your post. Whites are not illegal aliens unless them have broken our immigration laws and whites and all other Americans have the right to call anybody who breaks our immigration laws, illegal aliens because that is what they accurately are..
I guess the center of your blog did not seem to be too clear too me. I totally missed where you were going with all the various types of hypenated Americans.
Personally, I hate the habit of people to hypenate the type of American they are. But I don't believe whites did this to them as you seem to imply. It is the various minorities that have chosen to hang these labels on themselves. It is apparently part of ehtnic/racial pride. Most whites are perfectly happy if everybody just called themselves Americans without the label and the hyphen.
I am half white and half Cuban. I've never been told to go back where I came from and I don't believe my 100% Cuban mother has heard that either. Of course we don't play the minority game either. My mother does not call herself a Hispanic-American or a Cuban-American. And I don't call myself an English-Scottish--Irish-German-Cuban-American either. We are simply Americans and our experience would be that we have been accepted as such.
We are both vehemiently opposed to illegal immigration and my Mother has written several books on the subject. I guarantee you we have no problem with hanging the illegal alien label on anyone who breaks our immigration laws and also that we have no problem accepting anyone of any race or ethnicity who immigrates legally as fellow Americans and preferrably as Americans without a hyphen.
"I am half white and half Cuban. I've never been told to go back where I came from and I don't believe my 100% Cuban mother has heard that either. " Well that makes two of you. I was standing next to my friend(with "Asian" features) when she was told to go back to her country. well she was born in America and so were her parents.
"It is the various minorities that have chosen to hang these labels on themselves. It is apparently part of ehtnic/racial pride."
This statement isn't completely true! I believe all of these titles weren't given to each race by each race. In fact it's nieve to believe that proccess actually took place. Thanks for your insight though ;)
The problem with the Native Americans being the only real American citizens is that the United states and citizenship didn't exist for them, except for in tribes, untill white people set up the idea of ownership and government and forced it upon them. It is terrible how the world works as we see it. It seems you have to fight for what you want and even though it has been said that in war there are no winners there does have to be somebody who is better off, i just hate that because the most recent "winners" have been white means that i should be shunned for what other peoples ancestors did to others.
I'm not sympathizing with the terrible men who prosecuted the native peoples for simply living, I'm just pointing out that behind most every great nation is a horrible past of death and destruction. It's not what was done before that makes this country great. Its what we do now to overcome the atrocities of the past. Unfortunatly I'm a middle class white male so I'm sure that whatever I said will be looked on as just another bigited product of a naturaly bigited race that has only one goal since they came into being, subjegate other races in order to gain superioraty.
locke
In case anyone still feels the "Out of Africa" theory is still crap: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/02/080221-human-genetics.ht...
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