Feminism... ew.

seriously. men and women have achieved equality.

yeah right.

that's why a woman gets paid 73 cents to every man's dollar.

that's why the United States 68th in the world for women's political representation.

that's why less than 5% of the top 200 grossing films are directed or produced by women

and lastly

that's why there isn't an amendment in the constitution declaring all people--regardless of gender-- equal.

I believe this is all derived from social conditioning. Feminism, much like the dreaded ideas of chauvinism, is considered neither a good nor a bad thing. It does not cause women to be alone, and it does not cause women to become lesbians, estrogen-driven, "never gonna shave my legs and I'ma burn my bra!" individuals. It simply distracts itself from so-called "modernism" in American society by stating that yes, women CAN be equal to men, the same as different races are equal to one another. Of course it's easy to see a women who is alone & "lovin' it" and to label her as a feminist and to further thus assume that all feminists act as such. However, to do so is childish and immature. I believe to disregard feminism, as a whole, is disgraceful and irresponsible to the entire female race. We would not have the pleasures of shopping, buying a house, raising a kid as a single parent, or wearing revealing clothing if the women before us did not believe in placing shame upon men who thought us as submissive, populating creatures and moving forwards towards progression. It is ideas such as full dependency on someone based soley on their sex that, quite simply, push us back. We will never become equal to men, and perhaps we never really actually have to; but the notion of not standing for anything less proves us to be strong, revolutionary individuals.
Also, I must state that women, not just those considering themselves "feminists", still have a long way to go.
But, to each his own, I presume.

Several hundred years ago "across the pond" a King of England brought about divorce in the search for a "male" heir to "his" throne. He set the tone for generations of men to abandon women with undesireable female children in the search for the ultimate penile acheivement a boy who could carry on the family name. Since women are unfit to do such a thing.

I agree with you. I do not see the need for feminism in today's society.

I have a problem with females thinking that feminism means they can get away with anything, but the second that a man crosses any line, they are pigs.
Such as when a woman asks a man not to hang out with a female friend of his, she is asking him to respect her needs and the fact she is uncomfortable with it; however when a man makes the same request of a female in relation to a male friend the man is being controlling and unreasonable.
Feminism is supposed to be about equality, it is not supposed to be about women being able to be utter b*tches and be respected for it. It sickens me when women abuse the concept like that, and I am a woman!

Can you answer that question? You don't demonstrate any working knowledge of the concept of feminism in your blog, but basically just defend men in your own simplified, generalized, in some ways insulting manner. As a man, I certainly don't mind being defended along with the rest of my gender. If you want to attack misandry, go ahead and attack misandry. I'll be right there with you.

But you said you were attacking feminism. You never did. I've read some very bitter, man-hating feminist literature, but I also understand that feminists in general don't run around hating on men. And despite the gains that women have made in the past century, I don't see any need for feminists to sit down and be happy with where they're at. As previous commenters have already mentioned, women, on average, don't make as much for the same job as men do. Equality in the workplace is still a very real feminist issue, and that alone would be enough to justify the continued existence of the feminist movement. Add to that the fact that most elected officials in America are male, and we've certainly never had a female president or even vice president, and I'd say feminism is certainly not obsolete.

That's not my real problem with your blog. My real problem won't even take nearly as long to discuss: generalizations. You generalized feminists quite enough, which is unfortunate in that it's helpful to understand the people and concept that you're attacking.

But in the process of "defending" the male gender, you became about as insulting and patronizing as I could imagine you being short of accusing all men of rape. I'm referring in particular to statements like this:

They really care about us, they just have a different way of showing it (like with physical violence instead of poems. I'll bet Shakespeare's wife forced him to write those sonnets - conspiracy!).

I don't know if you were trying to be humorous or something, but did you just say that Shakespeare couldn't possibly have had the compulsion to write his sonnets without being "forced" by his wife? Generalizations are bad enough when they're complimentary (ie, "Asians are good at math"), but when they're insulting, they become downright unacceptable. Are you completely ignorant of the poetry of John Keats, William Blake, Robert Frost, Johne Donne, Samuel Coleridge, William Wordsworth, and countless other men from all over the world (sorry for the string of European examples; I'm working off the top of my head here)? Did their wives force them to write those poems, too?

On a personal basis, I know more male poets than female ones. Fortunately, I'm not the type to make blanket statements or generalizations about the poetic tendencies of males or females based on this.

But then, that's not the only part of your blog entry that has no basis in reality. Your spiel about feminism causing divorce, feminists hating men - it's all founded on ignorance.

I consider myself both a masculist (I believe that men should be equal to women) and a feminist (I believe that women should be equal to men). Both are very relevant in today's society and probably always will be. I especially agree with bubbalicious; women are extremely underrepresented politically and, before this changes, feminism will be completely necessary.

Feminism has grown from equality to superiority. We've all seen it: Women who feel they're superior to men, and act that way. It's rediculous, and really gives real feminists a bad name.

These are pseudo-feminists: Those that claim that women are somehow genetically superior. That's what truly angers me.

I prefer equality over superiority - that is, I prefer women be treated equal to men, but neither be treated as superior.

But that doesn't mean we shouldn't treat eachother differently - women are indeed a greater risk to hire. They may require leave for pregnancy, they can sometimes be a hassle around some workplaces, etc. This doesn't mean I don't support the cause of equal pay for equal work; it's that I don't support the cause of equal pay for less work. Women tend to take more sick days; women take pregnancy leave, etc. All these contribute to lower salaries; I suspect that it's rare for an employer to pay less merely because of a female not being male; just the risks associated with them.

The past is past. We're supposed to accept our differences and move on, rather than getting caught up in old issues and court cases.

____
If a society is willing to give freedom for temporary security, they deserve neither.

Although I happen to be a feminist my self, i find no judgement
in your post... I have more of an open mind person. Now some women get mad at one man && decide to take it out on the rest of the male population.. in ways that are sexist, therefore beating
the purpose of being feminist!!!!

you are right women are VERY different....
It was an opinion, back then, that women weren't meant to be educated
SOme ppl still believe that.... that is why I am a feminist... but as for the whole men population
I do not hate them.... I just despise Sexist PEople in general....
it isn't about hating men... it is about gaining the EQUAL amount of respect

&& about the divorce comment... i agree.... stupid decisions and people who
do not have the courage to face their problems && take the easy way out....
But the stupid decision is not always made by the woman....

-->God BLesS
((God Isnt threathing to me... He's my Savior))

Dear Jenesis,
It looks like Eileenio made it pretty clear in her blog that she is grateful for what feminism has got her. She is content with the way things are. Why bash on her for that, for actually being happy with life? Most extreme feminists I have met are rather unhappy. As for myself I stand some where in the middle. I know I'm smart (I graduated high school valedictorian) I'm going to college, yet I will have no problem giving up my career when it comes time to have children. Have you ever heard the expression "some of us want to wear lipstick to the bra burning?" I think that describes how I feel on the subject perfectly and seems to be what Eileenio is saying.

feminism was, at one time, an extremely valid and helpful concept. After all, now we can own land and vote - I'd say that's pretty darn great. However, as with most ideas, feminism has run it's course
For starters, the feminism movement was not born simply to gain women the right to vote and own land (for the purposes of this discussion we'll forget the fact that women have been land owners since the dawn of civilization). But perhaps you don't know or realize that, so we'll move on. The question then is why do you say that feminism has run its course?

RE: the stat that 51% of women in the United States are living single
Why should women have a problem feeling the need or the want for attention from the males of our species? Everybody (men, women, children, cats, dogs, pet snakes) wants to be loved and needs to be loved, but, for some reason, women feel like we have to be more like men.
Even if each and every one of the single women in this country were suffering from a lack of desire to be in an intimate relationship with a man, that's a determination they have a right to make about their own life course. That's a major tenant of feminism - that each woman has the right to determine for herself (a) how feminine she wants to be and (b) how she wants to live her life. So if a woman wants to be single leave it at that.
As for women trying to be more like men, I agree that this aspect of feminism is misguided. But you contradict yourself in one sentence here, saying that men want to me loved, too, but single women are trying to be like men in not seeking out love.

Diversity to people means "everyone acts like everyone else is exactly the same."
Anyone who takes diversity to mean that has obviously never bothered to learn the definition of diverse.

So, why feminism, girls? Huh? Why you be hatin' on our brothers?
Because when I say "I'm a humanist" it doesn't convey to your average person that I'm an advocate of the equality of the sexes; feminism does so I use that label more often. Nevertheless, I believe that feminism should be humanism, and that in no way leads me to be "hatin'" on anyone because of their genitalia.

And, you know what? I'm proud that I will someday rely (even partially) on a man. Because it's not bad to share, and to need from other people. It's all a part of life. Men deserve as much respect as women do for what they bring to the table
No it's not bad to share, but I like being self-sufficient and self-reliant. Sharing with someone is an entirely different matter from depending on them. In any shared living arrangement all participants' contributions should be equally valued, but this is an ideal and in practice humans haven't made it work out that way.

divorce, I've found, is another one of those causes of feminism. Women marry stupidly, figure it out later, and then become bitter because they weren't smart enough to look before they leapt.)
Feminism isn't about bitterness. If it is, then the individual(s) promoting it to be so have a misunderstanding of the aspirations of the movement. Not to mention the fact that there are plenty of feminist who've never married; I've considered myself a feminist since about age 16, so what turns folks like me into feminists if not divorce?

Respect the men; respect the women. Just do it separately, in the way that they deserve.
Both sexes undoubtedly deserve respect, but what do you mean "separately" and "in the way that they deserve"? Why must we focus so much on our physiological differences?

/jkh

I am damn proud to be a feminist. I have a boyfriend of three years, a brother who is my best friend, and many many guys are my good friends. Just because Feminism isn't about hating guys or being single. Feminism is about being yourself in a masculine world, and trying to get recognition for that. Feminism is about choosing what to do with your life and body and not be criticized. Your idea of what feminism is is only a stereotypical about who feminists are, and it's not true.

Eileenio I'm interested to hear your thoughts on all of these wonderful comments.

You there?

Hello?

you ask, so why feminism, girls? You don't understand. Well, the next time you walk into a pharmacy and the pharmacist won't fill your scrip for A) the birth control, or B) the morning after pill (even if you've been raped), and you want someone to help you - you'll choose feminism. The next time we have a madam speaker of the house, you can thank feminism. If you bother to look up non-progressive websites, run by people who believe that women should not have the right to vote or work, you'll quickly choose feminism. If you don't think it's right that a woman is arrested for giving birth to a still born, you have chosen feminism. If you think that women have a right, no matter which country they live it, to have access to education, information about their how their bodies work, then you have already chosen feminism.
To me, as a woman, as a human being, as a feminist, hearing someone say, why feminism girls? is the same thing as looking as a person of a different race and asking, why civil rights, huh? I hope you open a few more books, open your mind, and realize what kind of world you live in. To survive, you'd better be a feminist.

The main issue I take with the original blog, despite various inconsistencies and historical and statistical misrepresentations, is that it claims that the feminist goals have already been met while spouting ideals that helped bring about feminist action through their outrageousness. The writer claims that women have already acheived their equal respect, then says that this makes them bitter manly spinsters, echoing warped chauvanistic mentalities which feminism attempts to overcome.
No one can really argue that women are currently recognized as equals everywhere, or that the struggle for equal rights is anywhere near over, but there is something to be said for the manipulation of feminist ideals. Feminism is not about revenge or bitterness for sexism of the past, just as civil rights efforts for african americans are not about revenge for the past wrongs of racism. The fight for equal rights is about the present. It is about fighting ignorance and sexism through awareness and action. This must be understood by people who claim to be feminists just as well as those who do not. Bitterness towards men and feminism are not the same thing, and should not be confused by anyone whether they do or do not support feminism.

"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity."
-Dr. Martin Luther King jr.

"Perhaps the male coworker gets paid more because he's not taking time off to be home with the sick kids, taking them to the Dr & never took months or years off from his career to have kids. Maybe because of those differences he has become more valuable to his employer."

You say that like there's something blameworthy in having children. I guess what you're saying is that all childrearing responsibility lies with the mother AND it's somehow her fault. Interesting.

I happen to be single without children. So explain, based on your logic there, why MY salary is by default lower. Explain it to me. I really want to know.

You opined about feminism -- informed or not -- and a dozen or so strangers have taken the time to respond to it. (And because they said a number of intelligent things and generally refrained from being rude, I no longer feel the need to follow suit.)
Why did they do it?
Because they're trying to push their ideas on you?
Sort of. They're really just hoping that you take this opportunity to learn more about the issue.
Being in college sure is fun -- yep, it's more fun than earning an average of 70 cents on a man's dollar in the workaday world -- but it's also the time and place to figure out what's going on, so that when you get out there, you'll understand why things happen the way they do. I wish I had discovered feminism in college. It would have stopped me from judging my self-worth by the reactions of everyone around me, instead of owning it myself.
I'll give you a hint -- contrary to what the author of "Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus" would like us to believe, there's no "like men" or "like women." There's no one way to be a woman, any more than there's one way to be Black, or one way to be gay, or one way to be Jewish.
Each one of us deserves the right to be an authentic person and have an individual experience. That becomes a lot harder when we have stereotypical ideas of what makes a woman a woman, or a man a man.
No one else has the right to judge what makes me, or you, a woman.
Once I realized how much the world tries to foist this crap on women, it was pretty hard not to be a feminist.

I want to assure you that as a the father of two daughters, I remain very concerned about the empowerment of women in our society. You may not feel the need for this. Fine. I do not think you should be so glib and insist no one needs to be engaged in this very important struggle.

Not everyone in a relationship, certainly not everyone who is married, is loved. More to the point there is plenty of domestic violence, mostly by husbands and boyfriends, requiring the State to step in and separate the parties, issue restraining orders and jail the violent. I prosecuted domestic violence for 8 and a half years. Trust me. I hope you never find out how true this is.

No one I know would equate divsersity with sameness. Diversity is about placing value on difference.

I hope you take the comments to your blog to heart and rethink your position. After all, educating ought to be about accepting challenges and moving beyond uncritical thoughts.

In any event feminism remains vital in the search for social justice. I suspect it already has and will continue to benefit people like you.

Bob Oso

Females comprise more than half the human population, particularly in nations where female infants are not specifically aborted or killed because of their lack of social value compared to male infants, as is the case in India and China.
So when about 50% of all members of the U.S. Congress and Senate are women, and when it's par for the course fhat one of every two Presidents elected is a woman, and when about 50% of Chief Officers and vice presidents in business are women, and when women in the third world at the very least get to decide for themselves what they wear and who they marry and at what age and who they can speak to in public and don't have to worry about being mutilated, raped, or killed, then feminism will no longer be necessary.
Until then, Eileenio, you need to do some reading.

Honey, you need to get educated on the issues. Feminism is NOT just about being regarded as equal. It's about being TREATED as equal. For example, when such things as equal pay for equal work, (which you currently do NOT have--JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE A VAGINA, never mind that you may be a single mother of three kids and your male officemate has no kids and lives in his parents' basement) are a reality for women everywhere, only THEN will the fight for equality be over.

Doubtless you think you have nothing left to fight for because you are a pampered college student with the luxury of sleeping till 10 every day and going to class in your pajamas. When you are out in the real world, you will hopefully see it.

Also, one of your comments flat-out amused me--the one about skewing statistics being something "clever people with an agenda" often do. Does that mean that your statistics are correct and you are an agendaless moron, or your statistics are also skewed?

I don't think I have ever read such sad, ignorant assertions about feminism. Well, I have, but usually from the silver-spoon-reared men at Forbes magazine. I highly, highly suggest you do some reading before you start talking about feminism as if you know what it stands for.

1. Last I checked, feminism advises women to be single in lieu of an unhappy, unequal relationship. They advocate for divorce laws for the same reason. Some feminists believe that the institution of marriage is inherently patriarchal and therefore abstain, but they usually acknowledge that this is their choice and not someone else's, nor do they abstain from all romantic relationships. Notice that your study talked about women living WITHOUT HUSBANDS. That includes women in long-term, cohabitating relationships without the "sanctity" of a marriage certificate. That doesn't mean that 51% of women live alone with nothing but a cat for companionship, nor does it mean that the women who are living alone do not have a support network of a family or urban family. Feminists do not deny that women, like all human beings, require interpersonal relationships in order to maintain mental health. They just say that women shouldn't compromise themselves or their personal beliefs just to have those relationships. The world is a diverse place, and whether you're looking for friends or something more, odds are that if you're patient you will find people who will be supportive of you.

On this same note, you may want to look at your own inconsistencies: you accuse feminism of advocating that women "look before they leap" with regards to marriage, thus cheerleading for divorce, and then you attack the stereotype that feminists don't want women to get married before the age of 27. You accuse feminism of telling women to act like men and not need support from anyone, then you say that men "need to be loved", too. Which is it?

2. I'm glad to hear you advocate physical violence as a form of affection from men. Thank you for excusing every date rapist and spousal abuser in the world. I suppose I should be pissed at my husband for not loving me enough to react with possessive rage every time someone else in the world makes me angry. I'm a little bemused by your lack of faith in both men and women -- that men are so emotionally stunted that their only way to show affection is to threaten violence on behalf of a woman, and that women are so needy for affection that they should excuse the occasional slap across the face and/or bar-room brawl on behalf of her honor.

3. You advocate respecting women in the way that they deserve. How is that exactly? Because for a lot of conservative groups, this involves referring to them as vaginas with a supporting structure attached that are passed as property from man to man to be closely watched over and taken care of like a purebread show dog. However, perhaps I have missed something here and the incidental fact that women can birth babies means that we deserve to be treated like prize breeding stock as opposed to human beings with agency.

And lastly, this has absolutely nothing to do with feminism, but you may want to do some very basic research regarding Shakespeare before invoking him to support your anti-feminist tirades. At least half of his sonnets were written to a young nobleMAN, and the rest to a nameless "dark lady" who most certainly was not his wife. His wife he saw for perhaps a year or two of their marriage (tops) and, upon his death, he left her only his "second-best bed" while bequeathing the rest of his fortune and land to his eldest daughter. This is a completely unrelated rant, but it drives me absolutely crazy when people buy into the myth that Shakespeare wrote for love when in fact he wrote for much more material considerations (not starving to death in plague-ridden London). He just happened to be damn talented.

Maybe you are lucky not to have to go through any injustices in your life, but women still do all around the world, because they are not considered man's equal.

For example, as far as the UK has come in women's rights, it is still a fact that women are not paid the same as men for the same jobs, and that also many large companies will not hire married women, or women with children, or even women they SUSPECT will want to become pregnant soon, because they don't want to give them maternity leave! Working in the City is like an old boys club, women hardly get the jobs they are obviously well qualified for because they lose out to someone who went to Oxford/public school (in UK public schools are private, incredibly exclusive secondary schools) with the guy reading the applications.

These are all issues that I, as a woman, have to reflect on and think about for when I want to enter the world of work: I want to be successful in my field, but I also want a family, and it pisses me off that I have to reconcile this and think about this when I am only 20 years old.

Feminism is not about man-bashing, it is about being able to understand that male, female, black, white, tall, short, fat, thin, all should have the same rights. I love men, I respect men (those that respect me anyway), I want my future husband to have all the rights he is entitled to, but I want to be entitled to those rights too. Is that so much to ask?!

Feminism is about equality for ALL - women, men, gay, straight, black, brown, white, pink. It is not about man bashing and blaming. It IS about assuring that other people have all the opportunities we would want for ourselves. Feminism is also an extremely empowering cause to align women and men (AND MEN) on issues that face us all; like a living minimum wage, healthcare, immigration. Just because feminism looks at these issues as they relate to women does not make it bad ...or dead. Just because we are currently priviledged enough to live in a time where glass ceilings and and blantant sexism or not as glaring, does not mean we should forget where we came from or how far we have to go.

Maybe voting and owning land is enough for you, but it's not enough for alot of us.

Just FYI, that 51% figure was pretty flawed. They were counting all single women from age 15 and up & I don't think they were very honest about including the teenagers. Why would a media outlet have an agenda to push faulty info like that? I'm baffled.

What is wrong with a woman being alone and not lonely? A bachelor still has a certain amount of allure in popular culture, but a single woman is either a dirty old woman or an old-maid on her way to being a cat lady. I don't understand why the simple impulse not to get married should worry you so much. Some women do go so far as to say that no woman should rely on a man, and that is just as wrong as saying that women staying single is a defense mechanism. I think the bachelor mythos should be able to apply to women as much as men.

Res ipsa loquitur.
memor mori, mahalo.

All I have to say is that after hearing a feminist say that women are exactly the same is men I came to the conclusion that I personally believe in equal oppurtunity which isnt the same as being mans' equal in every way. Maybe I'll come back and write more but right now I've g2g :)

--Pauperes Commilitones Christi Templique Salomonis--
~ check out my art at http://miniwookie.deviantart.com ~

The point I'm trying to make is that I feel as if women have already achieved the recognition of the fact that their abilities are no different from men. I think that's it severely outdated and is now used as a shield to justify women who have a general distaste for men.

I don't think you understood what I was trying to say - not that women aren't as capable as men, but that they have a different way to do it.

Also, I know many women who were part of the generation that was encouraged to go to college, get jobs, compete in corporate America - and then they did, and then they realized that it wasn't as great as everyone made it out to be.

You seem to be focusing in on the physical differences/similarities between men and women. Studies have shown that men and women are emotionally and personality-wise different from one another - it's just genetics. Sure, there are exceptions to these rules (for example, women who are very good at math but not great an writing, men who are more interested in child-rearing than working) but, overall, these are the facts.

Also, while reading your reply, I find it very hard to see where it ties in with what I wrote. It felt more like a general lashing-out.

I see so much wrong with this.

The fact is that there are two differences which are not mutually exclusive to each other that make us either male or female. Either we've got more estrogen, or we've got more testosterone, which is determined by an X or a Y chromosome. Let's keep that separate from our frontal cerebral cortexes, which determine our personality, decision-making, etc. And biologically, all babies start out female in the womb before their bodies get the signal to either continue developing as they are, or to form an external organ rather than internal. If you haven't noticed, the male and female reproductive systems are incredibly similar, the penis corresponding to the vagina, the testes corresponding to the ovaries, etc. We really aren't much different from each other biologically.

We have been socially conditioned to believe that women's role is to nuture and bear children, and men's role is to do the hard stuff. But this is complete bull. Women have proven over the past years that they can compete with men in anything and everything from employment to athletics, yet women don't get the respect that they deserve. They still make significantly less than men in the workplace. They still are portrayed as sex objects in the media. And they still don't get the media coverage that men have received.

For example, in 2000, 40% of the athletes in professional athletics were female. Yet only 8% of reported sports were about female athletics. Incredibly disproportional. There is also a difference in the way that male and female athletes are marketed. Men are declared sexy for two reasons: physical attractiveness and talent. Yet female athletes are only sexy for their bodies and faces; they are also strictly marketed that way. Instead of portraying the strong female athlete, the media usually offers us images of women in bikinis, revealing clothing, or nothing at all. While male athletes are usually shown either looking comfortable in ordinary clothes, or dressed up in their uniforms. And oftentimes the only sports that are broadcast involving women are stereotypically feminine events, for example, iceskating.

Feminism does not cause women to become lesbian, nor does it force them to be alone, reject religious beliefs, accept abortion as appropriate, etc. Feminism is simply a means for women to be EQUAL to men because what is between our legs does not determine our ABILITIES. The fact that I can give birth to a child does not make me any less human than a man, and therefore I should have the same rights and same treatment that men do.

Also, it's not about specific people, nor is it about all men in general, but feminism is directed towards the injustices that women have faced possibly because of particular groups of men. There is a difference between feminism and male-bashing.

I suggest maybe you take a feminist course or two in school. You'd be surprised what you learn. Sexism isn't right, even if you are comfortable in your routine. Someday you'll realize that. Feminism is not, and should not be dead.