My problems with the bible fall under these reasons.
- The Bible was written by men
- Men have free will
- It has been translated
- Translations are very often not exact
- It was written roughly 200 years after the events for some books
- And the leaders pick what books to read and what books to leave out.
Many people forget all of that. They argue that God told them what to write. Okay so when it was being translated King James didn’t decide to just add in a few things that he wanted his people to follow? Many of the holidays in Christianity were Pagan holidays long before Christianity exist. Christians made Christmas and Easter on two of the biggest holidays to help convert Pagans. Roman Christians didn’t like the gay orgies so they wrote in the anti-gay bits. King James was wanting to kill witches and the Christians were wanting to convert the pagans so they added in the anti-witch bits.
And since when do you only follow certain bits of the bible. “Oh we only follow the New Testament.” If God dictated it than it should ALL be followed because his wisdom is beyond yours and what he said back then should apply now.
Also as someone who studies languages you can never translate exactly because of cultural references or terms that just have little meaning to the other language. For example In Japan there is a phrase that translates roughly into “Idiots can’t catch a cold.” Does that mean anything to you. Probably not. So I will translate it into a way you can understand it. “Idiots are so dumb that they don’t even know how to catch colds.” Just watch a foreign film in English subtitles and English dubs at the same time. See how different the translations are. Or if you know a language watch it in just the dubs and listen does it come out exact? Hardly ever. There are hints and emotions in all languages that one has to be completely fluent to understand. I never take anything translated word for word. It’s like the original is chocolate cake and what you get is corn cake. Similar but not the same.
You, sadly fall into the category of "Uneducated Opinions".
Much of what you said is true yes, but may ask you a question? Have you ever actually read the bible fully?
There ARE errors in the bible. Evil men DID make changes to the word of God. But it is illogical to discount the book in its entirety due to mistakes of men, when the words were written by the power of God.
That is why it is important to read with the guidance of the Holy Ghost. It helps us discern right from wrong. Then we can read without fear of being misguided by other men, or by the conclusions of our own mind.
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Of the few things in life that bother me, Only an uneducated opinion really gets my goat...
"Our problem is not that we aim too high and miss, but that we aim too low and hit."
~Ar
I have no problem with you expressing your opinion. Just be certain that that opinion falls within the terms of use you agreed to when you signed up for the site. Personal attacks are against those terms. That and plagiarism are the two biggest faults of ProU users. Don't fall into the trap.
~C
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Please understand. I do not intend on sugar coating what I say. I won't make personal attacks. They tend to deprecate what you say. I Will however state my opinions in absolute truth.
Perhaps I should put such a disclaimer in my Siggy? >__<
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Of the few things in life that bother me, Only an uneducated opinion really gets my goat...
"Our problem is not that we aim too high and miss, but that we aim too low and hit."
~Aristotle
I don't expect you to sugarcoat things. We have many a user on the site that tend to be... abrasive with their opinions. You seem to want to fit the mission of the site very much, and for that I am eternally grateful (really, eternally grateful...). Just don't resort to personal attacks and you'll be fine.
I just wanted to give you a friendly warning (that's not really a warning) because you could potentially go there very easily.
~C
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I have read the bible and I find most of it outdated and easily misinterpretated. I can discern for myself what is right and what is wrong. The bible won't help me do that. I also don't read self-help books and such, because I think that nobody has anything perfected. So I never follow books written by men as any sort of rule book. Advice, sure, but not something to base my life around. I live it for myself.
"I am a Stephens Woman."
Kinda like how people used to interpret the Bible into saying that slavery was right. Even the Bible doesn't have absolute truth in it because it has been distorted by biasedness.
I doubt you have read the whole Bible and still find so many fallacies in it. I have been a church-goer ever since I was out of the hospital after birth and I still haven't read the whole Bible. And by the way, not all leaders "pick" what books to read. Maybe religions that are actually led by an authority(ies), like Catholicism or Church of Latter Saints, but at my church, and many other denominations that I know of, we read whatever happens to appeal at the moment. In my particular church class, we are studying the gospels, but last quarter, we studied Hebrews. The quarter before that, we were in the Old Testament.
Please don't be generalizing when you don't know what actually goes on.
There is a time to live, and a time to die. But now it the time to break it down!
There are books written by people that you have never even heard of. That are kept away and haven't even been translated or shared with the public. Watch the History channel sometime. And yes I have read the bible. When I was thirteen I sat down and read it and decided it wasn't for me. I am currently reading about Buddism. And, yeah, I do know what actually goes on. There are so many secrets within Christianity if you knew you're brain would boil. But keep an eye because I'll soon write a blog about the history of Christianity and it's churches.
"I am a Stephens Woman."
I take it that you're one of those people who take things like "The DaVinci Code" seriously?
I hate to tell you this, but people write books for them to sell. They write books about things with lies in them to get people to buy it.
If you want truth, don't read an outside source's information. Go straight to the source of truth. Now I ask you. Did you look at the bible or did you READ it. This means thinking about it. Pondering it. Considering what it says and looking past the old english to the truth that you only find by seeking. Is that what you did?
Or did you read one of those screwed up "New English Translation" Bibles? I'd go so far as to say that they're blasphemous.
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DISCLAIMER: I am not being rude. I'm stating my opinion. No personal attacks are meant. Please give some leniency on how you take my words. imagine me saying them with a smile. ^__^
LOL Oh no I rather dislike the Da Vinci Code. I thought it was mildly entertaining at best. And yes I did READ the bible. *Is wondering why that part is so hard to believe* There are books in the bible that aren't included with the english translated versions. I mean they are just now "finding" Judas' book and translating it. There ARE others and if I could recall the names I would write them, however it's been a couple of years since I've studied Christianity.
"I am a Stephens Woman."
"I hate to tell you this, but people write books for them to sell. They write books about things with lies in them to get people to buy it."
Sounds like the bible to me. #1 on the best selling list. Hook, line, and sinker!
Tabias-
Sadly, people are using the bible for personal profit.
Christ said, "They will sell me for gold and for silver" This does not mean that the Bible is not true.
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DISCLAIMER: I am not being rude. I'm stating my opinion. No personal attacks are meant. Please give some leniency on how you take my words. imagine me saying them with a smile. ^__^
No but the fact that you know and everyone else knows that ..."There ARE errors in the bible. Evil men DID make changes to the word of God." should tell you that it's not true.
Tabias-
You are taking my words out of context. There are typos in my journal... Does that make it not true?
Not everything in a "true story" movie is completely accurate, but does that mean that the events never happened?
You logic is faulty. It's called a part-to-whole fallacy. You say that since this part of something is [fill in the blank], ALL of it is [fill in the blank].
It's illogical.
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DISCLAIMER: I am not being rude. I'm stating my opinion. No personal attacks are meant. Please give some leniency on how you take my words. imagine me saying them with a smile. ^__^
Whatever dude. That has to be the craziest thing that I've ever heard. A book "inspired by God" cannot and must not have mistakes. I know that we'll never agree so I'm finished with this conversation. I can't prove the book is false, and you can't prove it's the "truth". I respect your beliefs, but most Christians don't respect mine. Christians believe that everyone else is going to hell and they have no problems telling those people. I don't believe that Christians are correct, but I don't go around saying it. No body has proof of anything, so for one religion to claim that they are the "truth" makes no sense, especially coming from a religion as young as Christianity. And no I'm not saying that Wicca is older, better, or correct. We really just don't care. So say what you will.
Tabias-
I agree with you...Christians can be closed minded when it comes to accepting peoples point of view. That's why I believe the other person couldn't actually believe that someone read the bible and found the idiocy of it because she chooses to look past those descrepences. You almost sound like me in some of my other arguments for other blogs. I admire your thinking!
No day but today
-RENT
Well, you said it yourself..."There ARE errors in the bible. Evil men DID make changes to the word of God."
And yes it is logical (especially after what you just said), to discount the book in its entirety because you do not know which parts of the bible are mistakes and which ones are not.
"Have you ever actually read the bible fully?"
If I remember correctly, AshesTree is a Wiccan. If she isn't then I am and I can answer this question as well. Yes, I have read the bible. And I would go out of a limb and say that; percentage wise, I bet more Wiccans have read the bible than Christians. Wiccans usually come from Christian backgrounds, which is why many people choose Wicca. Because after they read the bible as a Christian, many of them ran as far away from Christianity as possible.
When I was involved with the International Church of Christ, they were real big on bible study, but most of the lessons were hand picked. I had a tendency to read more than I was supposed to and the more and more I studied the bible, the more and more I realized that it was just a bunch of stories, lore, and myth (just like Wiccan and many if not all other religions). Sure there are some historical accounts that go along with all religions, but a great percentage is myth, lore, and stories.
You can't trust anything that man does to the fullest. You just can't. I'll go ahead and state that I don't claim (nor do most Wiccans) that anything that I believe in is the "truth" or the "only way". I have my beliefs and some of them are completely different than the beliefs of anyone else on the planet. But I'm ok with that. Most if not all Wiccans will tell you the same thing.
You will never find a Wiccan going door to door telling people that they're going to go to hell if they don't convert. You have to want to come to Wicca. Most circles don't even let people fully in until they are the age of 18 or older. This way they are making the decision on their on.
Anyway, sorry about the soapbox. I get off subject sometimes.
Tabias-
Thanks very much Tabias. I am not a wiccan yet as I won't call myself one until I fully understand it, but I do feel a pull to it. You pretty much said everything I could so I won't continue on the same road just repeating things.
"I am a Stephens Woman."
Yeah, that's what I love about Wicca. You really can't bash it because we usually never even claim that what we believe in is the truth. We just don't know and how can we. Sure we could say that Wicca was "inspired by God", but then we'd be just like them. Not that we couldn't say that because if Christianity can say that a book that is only 1500 years old (at best) is the word of God, then why shouldn't we be able to do the same thing from the 1950s? Not that we would, but we could. I could go up on a mountain top right now and be "inspired by God" and create a religion, no wait, that's already been done and plus everyone would think that I was crazy...kind of like I think the folks from the time that the bible was written are crazy. Just something to think about.
"There are many paths to spirituality, but only you can choose which one to take."
Tabias-
Tabias-
I see what you're saying but I still can't believe you're the one writing it. Not for any other reason other than I usually say the same things. I often argue that if I were to write down thoughts and stories about religion and call it the next book of the bible and that God spoke through me and these were the words inspired by God, I would probably end up in a straight jacket at some looney bin. But people did it 2000 years ago and we take everything they say to heart. Wars are fought based on these crazy men's ideas. Does this make any sense??
No day but today
-RENT
I think some of your comments are true. I think HIStory from all angles have been tampered with. So how do you know what to believe, especially when it comes to the crap u learn in school.
LCProvide
The point of view of history is called Historiography. I don't just read what we are given in school nor talk to Americans. I converse with people around the world daily and debate and share ideas. I have read about the wars and history according to their point of view. I keep an open mind and if someone can prove to me that what I think is wrong I change it. I'm not asking other people to change I am just merely showing my ideas though this blog.
"I am a Stephens Woman."
My reasons for not following the Bible:
1. It is patently absurd.
2. It is, with a few exceptions, incredibly immoral.
3. It was written in an age before science was invented.
4. Hell, it was written in an age before toilets were invented.
5. It is self-contradictory.
6. There are many so-called holy books in the world; why favor this one with any extra attention?
Wow, okay let's start with you're biggest ignorant "fact"
"3. It was written in an age before science was invented."
Um science was when men discovered how to make fire, the wheel, Plato, Aristotle and so much more before man ever thought of the Christian god.
"4. Hell, it was written in an age before toilets were invented."
So? There were many things invented before plumbing doesn't make it true. People thought the Earth was flat.
"5. It is self-contradictory."
When did I contradict myself?
6. There are many so-called holy books in the world; why favor this one with any extra attention?
I haven't read the Kuran, I can't read Hebrew, and because it's a best seller so it's a great topic. It also gets people like you to read this.
"I am a Stephens Woman."
"Um science was when men discovered how to make fire, the wheel, Plato, Aristotle and so much more before man ever thought of the Christian god."
The Judeo-Christian god is considerably older than Plato and Aristotle.
I'm not really up on when fire and the wheel were first used, but that is not what most folks would define as science--that is, the scientific method, that makes testable claims and then tests them in a standardized way. Practical mechanics would be a better description.
"When did I contradict myself?"
I didn't say you were self-contradictory. I said the Bible is self-contradictory.
I think it's okay to completely ignore the BIble. But to me, personally, I believe it's quite a miracle that it exist today. Know that the entire Bible was written over the course of 1200 years, by over 50 to 60 authors, from all walks of life. The Bible, you are correct, is a collection of books. And there are have been some books that have been omitted because they were deemed fraudulent because the authors of those books, were not the true authors basically. But whats amazing is the continuity of the entire Bible. And what's amazing is that these people didn't know each other over the course of 1200 years, but you can still cross reference almost every passage, back and forth. Lastly, I would say that 99% of the Bible coincides with History and Science, including evolution. Yes, I am a God fearing man, but I also believe that evolution could be true.
You are right though. Religion has perverted teachings in the Bible by taking things out of context. It's equivalent to what the media does today.....
Now just because you don't believe in the Bible, doesn't make it's teachings illogical. Ethically, and morally, it has many things that if followed, will help anyone lead a better life...such as the ten commandments.
I loved your blog. You have every right to question the credibility of something that is as fallible as the bible. Everything about it is wrong except the idea of faith.
No day but today
-RENT
I haven't read the bible all the way through. Why? Well, the Bible was not meant to be read Genesis-Revelations. And frankly, some of the books are incredibly boring (A begat B, etc) It's funny, church attendance usually drops for cllege students, and I am finally going to a Bible study on a semi-regular basis! The thing about the ing James Version, si that although the text is gorgeaus, it was really poorly translated, and shouldn't be used on a theological basis. Heck, translation of religious text has always been highly political. When Today's New International Version used gender-neutral language, there was an uproar among some Christian groups.