Remember what happened to the Terri Schiavo case in 2005? I still think it was unethical to take her feeding tube away. If you said yes to it, then you should be considered as a murderer.
Many people back up Terri's husband because he claimed that Terri would want to die since she can no longer function correctly. I believe money was also an issue. My friends told me that it's mercy killing and they wouldn't want to live anymore if they were in Terri's place either. You cannot say that. You're not the one who is lying the bed trying to communicate with other people but cannot due to the fact that the body will not listen to you. Plus, if you give an excuse of, "She told me to kill her because she doesn't want to live her life in bed in that anymore"...then you are saying that you support assisted suicide, which is considered to be murder.
You must also be willing to help someone who is in emotional distress (suffering from depression, for example). If your friend is heart broken and depressed to the point that she does not eat or associate with anyone, then she asks you, "Can you kill me? I cannot live this way anymore." If you use that excuse to pull Terri's life support, then you should use the same excuse to help your friend commit suicide too. Am I wrong?
Then, you might tell me, "No, that's different. My friend is physically fine". Just because your friend is still capable to move physically, does that mean you should try your best to save your friend and not someone like Terri who is experiencing similar situation but cannot move? If so, you must support abortion as well. The mother can say, "I don't want want this baby because it wouldn't want to live when it comes out to this cruel world. I cannot support her." And you have to support abortion for that mother.
Basically, if you say yes to take life support away from someone like Terri Schiavo, you should say yes to assisted suicide, and you should say yes to abortion as well.
It's the same thing, isn't it? If you say no to one question, then you have to say no to all three. If not, then your opinion wouldn't make sense. You'll be contradicting yourself. Right?
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This is from a friend of Terri's family who was deeply involved in trying to save her life. Regardless a person's political orientation, please take all that you think you know about what happened here and set it aside. It was about her money and what was to have been a most of a million dollars payday for lawyers hired to kill with the help of a willing to kill judge. The woman was NOT in a coma or PVS. She did NOT want to die. Was she brain injured? Yes. But she could laugh and cry and to the limits of her injured abilities, she could talk. Please watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KPCsUBr6X4 Fact: Terri Schindler Schiavo screamed for her life. I am long beyond arguing with people about this. Democrat, Republican, liberal or conservative, and viewpoints to the left or right of the above mentioned lables, persons looking to see justice are welcome to communicate directly with me at jsipos@ij.net. Thank you. John Sipos, Tampa Bay Florida.
The simple fact is that the portion of Mrs. Schiavo's family that made these accusations had their day in court, and the determined that none of the claims above were true.
End of story.
percivale
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"Vi Veri Vniversum Vivus Vici." ~ V.
Frankly, I don't believe the person that posted above me. Her autopsy can speak for itself. She was in PVS. But anyway...
I do support Terry's decision to be removed from life support in that situation. I do support assisted suicide (you have the right to die as much as you have the right to live). I do support a woman's right to choose what happens with her own body (to a point). Call me a murderer all you want, that's what I believe.
~C
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As far as I know, there was nothing unethical done. As far as I know, Terry didn't want to live in that kind of circumstance. As far as I know, her personality was gone and could never be restored. I think that those are pretty good grounds for wanting to die.
"Every man makes a god of his own desire."
-Virgil
OMG! I can't believe you have a picture of Rimmer. Sorry for getting off topic, but I love Red Dwarf and I've never met anyone else who even knew what it was!
--The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return--
Yay, Red Dwarf!!!!
"Every man makes a god of his own desire."
-Virgil
You must also be willing to help someone who is in emotional distress (suffering from depression, for example). If your friend is heart broken and depressed to the point that she does not eat or associate with anyone, then she asks you, "Can you kill me? I cannot live this way anymore." If you use that excuse to pull Terri's life support, then you should use the same excuse to help your friend commit suicide too. Am I wrong?
As someone who has suffered (and if it weren't for the meds, still suffers) from deep depression and has been on the verge of suicide on more than one occasion, I can tell you that is very different. A person can recover from the darkness that is depression. It's not easy by any means, but it is possible.
Someone who is in a comatose state for an extended period of time, or is a vegetable, because of brain injury or the destruction of other vital parts and only survive because machines are keeping them breathing, eating, whatever, is not going to recover. They are doomed to be at the mercy of the machines while they lay, imprisoned, in their own bodies, unable to move or otherwise communicate. That is no way to live and I know I wouldn't want to live like that. In a situation like that, death is a release from what would otherwise be a life sentence with no chance of parole.
Basically, if you say yes to take life support away from someone like Terri Schiavo, you should say yes to assisted suicide, and you should say yes to abortion as well.
Again, that is a different matter altogether. An unborn child has never even had the opportunity to communicate its wishes. A grown person, on the other hand, has had the opportunity to discuss what to do in the event that something like Terry's case would happen to them.
That aside, while I don't personally condone abortion and would never commit it myself, I believe in people's right to choose. I also believe that if a woman wants an abortion, she's going to get one regardless. I believe in having the means to do so safely (and also giving the doctors the right to choose to support the process or not).
-- quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
I say yes to euthanasia and abortion. That doesn't make me a murederer. First of all, you're a sick person if you would rather make your loved one suffer through years of immobility and the inability to communicate. I know for a fact that if I was a vegetable, i would want my familty to pull the plug, unless there was a great chance that I would recover and do it quickly. As for euthanasia being the same as helping someone who is depressed committ suicide, that is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. The person who is depressed, first of all, has a choice whether they can live or die. If it weren't for the expensive machines, people in a vegetative state would die anyway. Depressed people can get help and their lives can be better.
And Terry Schiave could not communicate whoever said that. If she could, I'[m sure her family would not have pulled the plug. And how sadistic of you to think that they did it for money. Not everyone thinks as cruelly and as cynically as you do. I would absloutely pull the plug on anyone I loved if it meant saving them from a life in a bed with no way to talk to me or control any part of their loves. And even if they did "wake up" or gain some control one day, they would probably suffer from massive muscle atrophy, and would never be able to move again, anyway.
--The greatest thing you'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return--
Perhaps my use of murderer was a little bit offensive for some people. Even what I said here might not be what I'd do if I was really in that position. Thanks for all your input. I'd like to ask if you'd still say the same thing for people with mental illness, meaning those for are in the mental hospital. Their recovery is very slim...and most of them don't even know what's going on around them. And many of them are not capable of feeling emotions. What about elders who need machine to live or to breathe and cannot communicate? Would you say it's the same thing? By the way, I bare no grudge against anyone who disagrees with me. Even if you'd call me a cold hearted human being in return. =D
Mental iIlness is different from being in a Vegetative State. Although the life they will likely live will be difficult, they will still have some sort of person, not just an empty shell. As for the elderly who need help in their everyday lives, that is also different. They still have their higher brain functions and, although their lives would not be normal, they could still function in a way.
"Every man makes a god of his own desire."
-Virgil
So in vegetative state, the patient cannot feel emotions or communicate right? Then how do people know that the victim is suffer by staying alive on the life support since they say the patient cannot feel pain and is not aware of what's going on around her. Am I making an ass of myself or what?
I believe that in a case where the person is in such a state, if they do not have a living will, then it should be up to the family.
"Every man makes a god of his own desire."
-Virgil
What about elders who need machine to live or to breathe and cannot communicate?
If the elder made the decision to not be kept alive by these means, then they have the right to have their wishes fulfilled.
~C
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"If you said yes to it, then you should be considered as a murderer." Said yes to what? She's involved in a murder trial? I demand to face my accusor! It's my constitutional right!
Nicholas Aden
Self-Promotion
lol Thanks for lighten up the mood. Although I'm not sure if it's supposed to be funny. Made me laugh though.
The same year she collapsed there was a Florida Supreme Court decision that clarified that feeding tubes are a medical treatment that can be refused, and that even a patient's oral statements (before they became incapacitated) must be followed.
The same decision also noted since oral statements don't automatically rise to the "clear and convincing" standard (unlike a written advanced directive), likely a court would have to determine whether oral statements made rose to that standard.
That is precisely what happened in the Schiavo case - the husband petitioned the court to make a determination, the court heard testimony from both sides of the case (in the end, there were 2 trials), and multiple appellate courts affirmed the decision of the trial court.
Not surprisingly, those appeals took several years.
But a court will always try to carry out the patient's wishes, regardless of the wishes of the patient's spouse, parent, sibling, or other relative.