The reason I made a new blog for this is because i think that the blog I was reading that made me interested about this went in a different direction than I am taking this but I think this does answer one of the questions posed on the blog.
From http://www.nimh.nih.gov/publicat/adhd.cfm
Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD) is a condition that becomes apparent in some children in the preschool and early school years. It is hard for these children to control their behavior and/or pay attention. It is estimated that between 3 and 5 percent of children have ADHD, or approximately 2 million children in the United States. This means that in a classroom of 25 to 30 children, it is likely that at least one will have ADHD.
ADHD was first described by Dr. Heinrich Hoffman in 1845. A physician who wrote books on medicine and psychiatry, Dr. Hoffman was also a poet who became interested in writing for children when he couldn't find suitable materials to read to his 3-year-old son. The result was a book of poems, complete with illustrations, about children and their characteristics. "The Story of Fidgety Philip" was an accurate description of a little boy who had attention deficit hyperactivity disorder. Yet it was not until 1902 that Sir George F. Still published a series of lectures to the Royal College of Physicians in England in which he described a group of impulsive children with significant behavioral problems, caused by a genetic dysfunction and not by poor child rearing—children who today would be easily recognized as having ADHD.1 Since then, several thousand scientific papers on the disorder have been published, providing information on its nature, course, causes, impairments, and treatments.
What Causes ADHD?
One of the first questions a parent will have is "Why? What went wrong?" "Did I do something to cause this?" There is little compelling evidence at this time that ADHD can arise purely from social factors or child-rearing methods. Most substantiated causes appear to fall in the realm of neurobiology and genetics. This is not to say that environmental factors may not influence the severity of the disorder, and especially the degree of impairment and suffering the child may experience, but that such factors do not seem to give rise to the condition by themselves.
This was writen referencing many very accredible resources including:
7Faraone SV, Biederman J. Neurobiology of attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder. Biological Psychiatry, 1998; 44; 951-958.
Consensus Development Panel. Defined Diets and Childhood Hyperactivity. National Institutes of Health Consensus Development Conference Summary, Volume 4, Number 3, 1982.
8The ADHD Molecular Genetics Network. Report from the third international meeting of the attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder molecular genetics network. American Journal of Medical Genetics, 2002, 114:272-277.
The MTA Cooperative Group. A 14-month randomized clinical trial of treatment strategies for attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD). Archives of General Psychiatry, 1999;56:1073-1086.
I think that this shows that A.D.D. is a real disorder.
Psychology is a very unreliable "science" that is unsure of how it should even view itself. It doesn't have the hard methods to follow that other sciences have. This being said, just because an idea comes from a questionable source doesn't make it bad.
I honestly don't think as many as two million children suffer from true ADHD, and I absolutely don't think current treatment methods work. WE consider it an illness, but just because a kid doesn't pay attention doesn't mean he is mentally ill. I seriously doubt most kids couldn't learn to handle themselves. Not to say ADD is "fake" but it is way over diagnosed.
Res ipsa loquitur.
Memento mori, mahalo.
This is coming from a government sight. I think it is a pretty reliable source. And the treatment does work very well for kids who have it.
The kids I know with ADD got amphetamines to help them focus. They didn't get any real therapy to help them control themselves on their own. They used the drugs they got reasonably responsibly, but still basically used it like speed. Now my problem isn't that they were given drugs, but that they weren't given options or therapy. Especially at such a young age it seems wrong to force drugs on a kid.
I also think a lot of parents and psychiatrists jump to ADHD when they shouldn't. I have a lot of friends who have had major damage done because they were medicated for all kinds of things when they shouldn't have been. Besides, what methods are they using to treat these kids? What are their success rates? How did the kids feel?
Res ipsa loquitur.
Memento mori, mahalo.
It seems like they just do not know what to do about it.
Alright, I'll buy that. I still say at least 25% of kids diagnosed don't have any kind of major imbalance. Like how I just made up an arbitray statistic there?
Res ipsa loquitur.
Memento mori, mahalo.
I just thought of something.
We have all these things-A.D.D., ADHD, and all the other things out there. But how come others don't? How come the Amish don't have them? How come you don't see Mennonites with any of these problems?
To me, that right there just proves that it is made up things. It is all psychological.
ok, see I've just had a fascinating experience with the Amish and mennonites that made me ask all sorts of unanswered questions.
Have you ever seen an Amish person with Down Syndrome? With schizophrenia? What do the Amish do with their pedophiles? Do they have them? Do we hear about them? How do they handle murderers and wife beaters? Do they not have them? Does that mean those conditions don't exist in non-amish situations? Or that the Amish have something special going on we should look into because they don't have these very real things? Or is their world just more carefully shielded from view.
I've wondered.....
www.worldcantwait.com
I don't believe it happens. I have never seen an Amish person with a mental or physical disorder. They take more care when they are pregnant, they take more care in general. I highly doubt they have pedophiles, because they have respect. They believe what they are taught, and they know of respect and kindness, they don't do inhumane things like we do.
First of all how often are you around amish people. And second of all, of course there are amish people with mental and physical disorders. It is rediculous to think that they are immune to dissease because they "care" more. Because someone cares more will not change their genetic make up.
Ever since I was 7, my family and I would go down to Shipshewana in Indiana, AKA-Amish country. That was 1 day, 1 time a year.
Now however.
I live in Indiana (Michigan before), I am just outside of Amish country, and the Amish are always here in town (surprised me when I first saw them in this town actually-I didn't think this small town would have Amish, but they do.
They are not immune, that isn't what I said. BUT-they don't have the same things we do-because most of ours are all psychological things. You believe they exist because a pill exists for it. They don't have the pills-therefore, they have no reason to believe that anything is wrong.
And the 'caring' thing-isn't emotional.
The "caring" is when they are pregnant, they don't smoke, they don't drink, they don't harm their bodies the way we do.
This comment reflects a lack of knowledge and understanding about Amish people and their society. They are subject to the great majority of the mental and physical disorders suffered by the general population, and in addition, a considerable number of genetic disorders that are very rarely found outside of their community. This is because of the fact that they marry only within the Amish faith, and this has resulted in a very narrow gene pool in which it is quite difficult to avoid marrying one's cousin. (Contrary to what some of the mainstream media has tried to portray, their leaders do try to guide Amish young people not to marry their first cousins.)
Amish people do suffer from various mental disorders, among which depression is prominent. This is obviously not a problem that is created out of one's imagination, but as we should all realize by now, has clear and objective neurochemical and genetic factors that play a large role in it.
The Amish have some different ways of dealing with illnesses than the mainstream society, of course. Some of these ways are very admirable, and others show some of the weaknesses of their culture, which do exist, as every culture has its strengths and weaknesses. One of the problems they do have is a lack of traditions about how to deal effectively with domestic violence and inappropriate sexual behavior. Yes, these tragically do take place among them. They do have processes that are used to confront and try to change people's behavior, but these don't always work. Fairly recently, some of them are starting to work with counselors, which was not part of the tradition. I think it remains to be seen whether the kinds of counselors who are being seen are going to work well. I don't have first-hand knowledge of all this, but I've been learning what I can about the problem. There is a website called Amish Abuse, which has a lot of shocking information about cases within a very extreme sub-group of the Amish, but the version told there is perhaps a tiny bit one-sided.
I'm afraid "redshansneck" has been influenced by the vague, idealized notion of Amish society that one simply picks up through general social channels and the media, without having gotten to know them directly or by in-depth study. Of course, their culture is utterly committed to non-violence, and they try very hard to embody Christian love and kindness. However, it is naive to believe that there could be any human society in which individuals don't become either mentally ill or in some other way lose track of how to do what is right. The Amish have their wrong-doers among them, and they would be the first to tell anyone that they are not a bunch of plaster saints, but struggling human beings like everyone else. They may try to live by higher moral standards, but naturally there are those who fall into sin (as they would see it) and do wrong. To say "they don't do inhumane things like we do" makes them into an alien race of beings.
I've lived probably longer than many of those posting here, and something one tends to learn with time is that good intentions and strong ideals can exist in people who commit terrible mistakes and do all kinds of harm to others. Haven't you heard a few stories here and there about religious leaders who have committed notorious acts that violate their beliefs? You may say they are simply evil and cynical, but I think that is a very simplistic and delusory perception.
http://www.progressiveu.org/230857-blogs-as-comments
You might want to read that.
That being said-I just want to say, I respect your opinion because of the manner you proposed it, however, I do not appreciate you trying to downsize me and my knowledge. I know more than most, and I believe you are the one with the distorted view.
Hi,
Thanks for respecting my opinion, and sorry that you feel I was trying to downsize you. That was certainly not my intention. I just meant to express my view that you are lacking in knowledge, which is different from commenting on your value as a person.
I've just posted an even longer comment/blog here:
http://www.progressiveu.org/000825-burning-questions-about-the-amish#comment-124198
Those who are really interested in the topic might find that interesting, but people whose interest tends to run out after a paragraph should skip it! ;-)
Dear Bonnie,
the link that reshnsneck posted was her opinion on the size of comments. You are welcome to apply those rules to her blogs.. On my blog people are always welcome to leave long comments, as long as they are well thought out or entertaining. I do read them unless they show a pattern of mean spritied ness and childishness, then I ignore them. Thank you for your comments, both of them.
www.worldcantwait.com
That argument does not make sense to me. Because a society that does not believe that they should use electricity does not have medicine that has to do with the brain means it does not exist. The only way to understand the brain is through MRI's and so on which all require electricity and that is why they don't treat mental problems. They probably don't treat depression either but that is a very real mental problem.
They wouldn't treat it because they don't have it.
Nobody can know for sure if they do or not, BUT-I am pretty sure that if they do-it is a very rare one or two every thousand or so. Think about it-they aren't exposed to the stuff that we are, they don't see the things we do, they have no reason to have these mental problems that we supposedly have.
Many mental problems are that are genetic and so on, they have DNA also therfore they are just as likly to get it.
fascinating, we need a blog just on the amish. Sadly it would be unlikely we could get a first person corroboration.
www.worldcantwait.com
There is a blog just on the amish. Check out amishamerica.typepad.com.
I am not Amish but have spent the past 3 years working with and studying the Amish in over one dozen communities throughout the US. I personally know hundreds of Amish, have been in their homes, eaten dinner with them, discussed their beliefs and practices, laughed and joked with them, chased loose cows around farms, etc. They are not living angels, but I firmly believe they get a lot of things right. The blog is relatively new, but I think you might like it if you want to learn more.
How do you know though? They claim obesity is a disease. They also claim that alcoholism is a genetic disorder passed down from father to son (or mother to daughter).
I thought of another point last night too-on the entirely MRI thing, -you said they have to have MRI's to show the problems. An MRI does not show things such as A.D.D. or ADHD. How does that prove anything?
SPECT studies do (SPECTS are like MRIs instead of Magnetic Resonance Imaging its Single Photon Emission Computed Tomography).
www.worldcantwait.com
It shows abnormal brain activity in areas of the brain. Thererfor showing A.D.D.
That doesn't quite prove anything. They claim everything nowadays that is related to the brain can be seen by "different activity" -chemical imbalances, anything they can grasp.
ADD is real. I know two people who are severly held back by it. One, could not function at a normal college and kept dropping out. Then she came to the extemely flexible liberal radical college and was able to graduate because the social stucture was malleable in the places her brain wasn't. she's incredibly smart and does wonders with kids but the A.D.D. impairs her functioning in all other aspects of life.
The other person, I'm running on the theory that it was learned biologics...ie he grew up in an alcholic system from day one with his father patterning the add behavior. As he took on those behaviors, they were immensely helpful in coping with not only the alcholic parent but also the negligence of the father. The wheel makes the rut, the rut traps the wheel. As his brain biologically received this feedback as he developed, his brain was neurochemically and structurally shaped by this stimulus. Now if you took Spect studies of his brain, you would see a tremendously different image than one of those without A.D.D.
Just my running theory though.
Consider reading Dr. Amen's books, like "Change your brain, Change your life" or his othe books on A.D.D.
the most fascinating things were the SPECT studies, which are like PET but a bit more real time. They biologically demonstrate A.D.D.
www.worldcantwait.com
my 10 year old son has ADHD. I have him on meds. Once in awhile we take him off of the meds for 2 weeks to see if he still needs them. Let me tell you he does. Off of his meds has an affect on his school work and at home. It cannot control it yet. We are working on it though.