Today I went to court to fight my ticket and found out something I never would have imagined. Cops don't need to have a radar detector or even stop-watch to give you a citation for speeding. All they truly need are their eyes. In most courts, as long as the officer is reliable their statement and view will stand in court because during their initial training many of them had some exposure to radar.
This is a joke, basically we are saying that by mere sight people can tell someone else's speed in a car. I haven't had training but I have been around the gym a lot and also been around a lot of cars in my lifetime and to be completely precise down to the mile would be extremely hard. This leaves room for huge margin of errors, which is sad because in most states the difference between 10 and 11 mph is 1 pt, which doesn't sound like that much I know. But when it's on top of two others, if you have any past traffic issues you are getting close to the limit.
If you fight it, it's your word versus theirs. How many courts do you think will side against the cop? Probably not that many unless there is something you have against the cop. Just thought I would let people know that us normal people can't possibly even begin to predict the speed of another car to the mile, yet police officers could possibly be doing it every day. From now on if you get a speeding ticket look in the corner of your ticket at detection device, if there isn't a number you have just seen a taste of the magical super powers the cops have when it comes to speed. Good luck all and safe and slow driving!
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I totally didn't know that cops didn't need a radar or anything to give you a ticket. I got one not too long ago but he was using a radar gun. I think that's rediculous...what about having to have a warrant to search someone? Isn't that like the same thing? Why would they have to have reason for some things but not others? That's rediculous!
<3 Desi <3
You would think so.. but apparently certain things can hold up. They did have prior training sure, but who knows how long ago, and how often the training is brushed up on. It's a crazy crazy world. Some of the laws out there are completely outlandish and should either be changed or re-worded in my mind. THe interesting thing is though, if they stop you for "Speeding" can they throw the book at you, if when they pull you over you have something illegal in your car and such... because of that they have responsible belief, I would imagine because they can see it. So they can charge you on both if I'm not mistaking as long as it is open.. I don't believe it's like a warrant case because they aren't searching for anything in particular and it's the plain sight policy. Kinda interesting though.. and a lot of crap..
Cops do feel arrogant, because they are in control of the situation. It's just not fair that they can just assume the speed with their keen sight. They don't have much evidence to give you a ticket!
Hi Jenni,
First and foremost if you lost that ticket in court because the cop eyeballed your speed, then you were cheated and the judge/cop was wrong. It is never ok for a law enforcement officer to judge your speed by looking at your car and making a best guess judgement. What they can do is use a radar gun or they can pace your vehicle with their car. Which means they follow you and based on how fast they are going they can ticket you. There is also something called timed marker pacing. Where they have a confirmed formula based on the time it takes you to go from one known point to another known point. Usually this can only be used in a location like a highway because they have multiple points that are evenly spaced. Also, for each and every method, you as a citizen has the right the challenge the validity of the method used.
If a radar gun is used you can ask when the officer was last certified (usually every two years or so) and when was the radar unit itself last calibrated and certified (usually every year).
For pacing, you can ask when the vehicle was calibrated and what the accuracy of the speedometer is and if that specific patrol is certified as a pace vehicle, it doesn't have to be but it holds up better for them if it is. Be aware though that most vehicles are certified and calibrated to pace other vehicles.
The last one if using a timed marker for pacing is based on a formula that has been proven and provided for the department. Normally the accuracy of these formulas are very accurate.
If you haven't been to court yet then by all means call the local department and ask for the officer's records. See if he's been challenged in court or have ever been reprimanded for improper ticket writing.
If you have already gone to court, please contact the local courthouse and ask if there is any procedure to file a complaint against the judge for an improper judgement.
This response is getting to long but please contact me if you have any questions. Also, I let me know if either one of you have questions about warrants. Or google probable cause.
Hope this information helped.
v/r
Sam
Wow that really helps I know i haven't commented before but i just read the comments and you explanation helped a ton. Thank you.
Wow that really helps I know i haven't commented before but i just read the comments and you explanation helped a ton. Thank you.
Wow that really helps I know i haven't commented before but i just read the comments and you explanation helped a ton. Thank you.
although it does not seem right, law enforcement officers do not need a radar to pull you over for speeding, they do have training for this but also its kind of easy to tell if a car is doing 50mph in a 30mph zone by just watching the car, its an every day thing they deal with just like brushing your teeth persay, after doing it enough you have a routine at how you brush your teeth, something like that, was kind of a bad example but kind of hard to explain. This goes the same for officers watching the speed with out radar. Most of an officers work is patroling in their vehicle so after days and months of just watching cars pass and so on they start to get that routine of knowing about how fast this car is going and how fast that car is going. Might sound like a joke and might sound unfair but its true and thats how it works...If you want to try to get out of a ticket best bet is to ask for the officer to be at your hearing, if he doesnt show up the ticket cant go through, if he does show up then you can kind of use the fact that he didnt have a radar as your case but it probably wont hold up with a judge. This is how the world is though, sorry if i wasnt any help.
jake pitcher
Umm I already knew that.. that's what I wrote my post on. The thing is though when a cop is without radar, and just goes from what they think you were doing that can be the difference between 10 and 15 over.. which is the difference of a point and a smaller fine. It's one thing when cops are familiar with the system although I don't know how much I agree with that when the cops are usually using radar, or haven't had radar in their cars for a long period of time. We all need to be retrained in things and to have stuff refreshed in our minds and if the cops has only had radar for a week while in training and either has only been a cop for a few months or has been a cop for a long time with no one checking on if they are still checking speeds properly this can be a huge problem. Why would it help to have the officer at your hearing? You even said if they aren't there it gets thrown out. I really don't believe this is a good method on a college campus. At my college there are a bunch of hills and swerves that would distort the look of speed it's very easy to misinterpret that's why people that are speeding at my school don't get pulled over. Instead the cops wait until they leave the premise of the school and then other cops will get them for speeding. The school cops are usually just there for enforcement at my schools because of the lack of radar.
You sounded unsure to if it is a choice law enforcement officers have to estimate speed with out a radar, was just clearing up your answer a little bit, and i didnt say it would help having the officer there, it would help asking for the officer to be there because if you ask for the officer to be at the eharing and he does not show then the ticket gets dropped, its a 50/50 chance at wether the officer will come or not due to his case load, some officers will just say forget it and blow off the ticket because they have to much going on to worry about a simple speeding ticket, if the officer does come to your hearing however your pretty much screwed because its your word against a law enforcement officers word infront of the judge and the judge will almost always lean towards the officers word
jake pitcher