For the last few years, I have slowly been uncovering cases of sexual abuse (in most cases, molestation) among my female friends, friends of friends and even strangers.
I have to say, it is getting pretty ridiculous.
I remember growing up and seeing the T.V. adds, and hearing the people say "If anyone ever touches you in that way, report them immediately." and as I have grown older, and really heard the cases I know of none that have actually gone reported.
Why?
Because it's not that simple.
A case of sexual abuse in the family messes with a kid a lot more than it ever would by a stranger, because often a child still loves their parent/brother/whomever even during and after the abuse. Or even if they loathe that parent, they don't want to send him off to jail and disturb everything that they know is their life, which is already being disturbed.
Basically, it is an impossible responsibility for a child, which punishes them for the wrongs of a the wrongdoer.
But what is the solution?
Do you continue to allow these people to be abused, to have years of sexual trauma, and their family members free?
Truthfully, I don't know. The best solution is to prevent the abuse in the first place: Why does it happen? Is it a natural inclination? Something from the media?
Do you somehow push family counseling as an alternative?
Maybe we could reach out to the abusers to take responsibility for their own actions, offer free private counseling?
I know these cases will continue to go unreported so long as they are within the family.
Right now I know personally know five people who have been abused and will never report it.
How do we stop this?
I want real solutions, that apply to real human beings, with complicated emotions, not just more sex offender lists and health class videos.
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Maybe this is happening is because some families want to keep things a secret because there's a such thing as "family secrets".
Read my blog!
Will, In God words, They will wish that they were never born. for do ye not suppose that they will receive no punishment for doing such a evil thing,. Great shell be there destruction when they stand to be Judge Before God, For there wickedness among the children of God. These false Priest that practice Priest craft among the children of men think that God will not condom them for the acts of abuse in raping children. For they are deceive by the Devil to believe such a thing. But know this they will be cast into the Pit of hell prepared for the devil and his angles .His followers. So we need not think that man can get away with anything. .For we must all stand before God to be Judge for what we do on this earth. We are in a time of Probation to prove to our God that we will choose good or evil. Good to return to live with God Evil to be cast into the pit of hell. Amen
Christianity has nothing to do with "good works." Yes, you are supposed to be a compassionate, moral, just person.
But He died for a reason.
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this is war. every line is about who i don't wanna write about anymore. [Brand New]
http://progressiveu.org/143541-how-to-survive-the-2008-elections
Your statement: Christianity has nothing to do with "good works.” Why do you permit your self to be deceived by the Devil .If God is there trying to help us learn his ways, his truths ,Then what do you think the that devil is trying to do, Destroy us from the truth, you know Deceive us, If we give him that opportune. For this is what I have been talking about .People do not have all the truth of the gospel. .And because there is more to the gospel. People are not willing to believe. So they are still left in darkness. You do not know the scriptures FOR IF YOU DID, THEN YOU WOULD KNOW WHAT THE LORD expects of you. .Dose Jesus not teach us to follow him .To follow his example ,Now why do you suppose that he would tell us to follow his example . It is for the reason that he knows, that we will ALL be judge for our works. Think then when you stand before Jesus Christ do you not think that he will ask you if you followed his example .now if ever Christine in the world were to follow the example of Jesus then do you not think that this world would be a world of Love and compassion ,and that there would be no suffering. .Jesus had compassion for ever one and you and me and ever one is to learn this. Are you willing to follow Jesus Christ .If you do, then in no way can you loose your reword in the kingdom of his Fathers .Many people learn not the precepts of the Lord, For this cause they do not under stand and are still in darkness for they do not have the fullness of the truth of the Gospel. Weather people believe or not we will all be Judge for our works .meaning what we do in this Life .Remember this always. Are you A true Christian. That is only to be answered to your self Am I.
John 3:16: "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life."
Where does that say we go to heaven if we're good but go to hell if we're bad?? Maybe I missed something.
Nope, don't think I did...
John 3:17: "Indeed, God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Need I say more?
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this is war. every line is about who i don't wanna write about anymore. [Brand New]
http://progressiveu.org/143541-how-to-survive-the-2008-elections
The only way to stop it is to report it. Because molesters who will sexually abuse family members, will often do it again. That's how you prevent it from happening; report it the first time, and show these people there are consequences to their actions.
My problem is, that you are telling this to an eleven year old girl who is still emotionally connected to said father/brother/whomever.
Is there a way to solve this without putting that kind on her?
Because as it stands currently, she'd rather just deal with the abuse, than have to go through with reporting it in a lot of instances.
Is there a way to help the child and the abuser, while still punishing the abuser, and not placing all of the responsibility and guilt on the child?
You don't help abusers.
You put them in jail.
Sweetie, tell your teachers, your parents, someone you trust. Do something about it, or this person will do it again to another child.
I dont know abused children.
I only know adults who were abused, and have since moved on with their lives.
It was not my decision, these people can handle themselves at their age,
Nor do I personally know any of the abusers.
I believe this issue is oversimplified, and jail is not the solution for everything.
From my experience, most people I know who've been in jail only come out worse.
Jail is better than being free in society.
The answer lies in (a) longer sentences, and (b) more effective reform.
The real issue I am getting at is that even if they should, children are not going to report their parents whether they should or not.
Is there a more creative way of reaching out to the abused, rather than the child, to take responsibility for him or herself?
Im looking for alternative solutions, because it doesnt seem like the "Get the kid to ship them off to jail" solution is working.
I think child abusers are sick pigs, and I'm not saying they don't deserve jail. What I am saying is a child, who has already gone through so much does not need to be the one to rip her family apart. I am not saying this to protect sex offenders, I am saying this for the child. One of the reasons so many abuses go unreported is because children want to protect their families. Is there a way to draw these children out, and deal with the situation gently, so they feel safer maybe?
Why would you not teach your children to do the right thing? Did it ever occur to you that this is the problem, the stigma attached to it, exactly what you are doing now?
Stop blaming the child for ripping a family apart. The abuser needs to face the consequences of their actions, or they will do it again. Statistics show this.
Children should be taught to tell their parents immediately, the first time it happens. There is no shame, no tearing apart of the family. Because the abuser, they aren't "family" in the sense of loving and caring. They are a predator, that needs to be removed from society and prevented from doing further damage from that child and many others.
I know, I have just talked to people who still loved their abuser, alright?
Yes, the person is a predator, yes, they need to be severely punished, yes yes yes.
But Its not a punishment because of a stigma, its a punishment because when our little human brain is formed, we love our family and trust our family, and they can do a lot to us before that does away.
The abuser needs to face consequences, YES!
Okay, I get that you think all sexual predators are monsters, and your right.
But I still think they're are healthier ways of dealing with them, that could help the child deal with the trauma later in life.
When their is this much human emotion, and distortion it becomes a complicated issue, and it's people like you who say "Your brothers a monster!" who make people afraid to deal with their issues, because they don't want to face that this person they have grown up with is a monster, as well as the fact that they have been abused!
And it's people who you who say, "Hide from your experience." who do the real damage.
I know, I was raped, and I hid from it for three years. You have to face it, and force them to face the consequences, especially if it's someone you trusted.
There are no compromises here, but there are happy endings and there is eventual healing. But only if you deal with it, head on, and you stop this namby-pamby oh-the-poor-abuser bullshit.
Yyou are putting words into my mouth.
I did not say anything about "oh the poor abuser"
Don't give me that shit. I am not saying we just have to love them and it will be alright.
I am saying that there are alternatives to a simple jail sentence which does not mean Isolation isn't the right answer either. I dont KNOW what the right answer is, I just know we don't have it yet. I brought this topic up to talk about solutions, so women would be able to adjust and cope with the betrayal that comes with sexual abuse inside the family. All we have talked about so far is how people hate rapists.
For your case, I'm sorry, and I hope everything worked out well.
This is an issue that I don't know if one blanket solution will solve everything.
Isolation is part of the solution. Because letting them free into society to find more victims certainly isn't.
Again, the victim comes first. I have no sympathy for the mental health or psychological well-being of a sexual criminal.
Anajantz:
Thank you for acknowledging the hardships children have to face when coming forward with abuse. It's not as simple as telling children to report it. The child has to feel safe telling. The child has to be supported by adults. If the child tells and is told to "stop lying", it will compound the trauma. A lot of times, people want to look the other way. It's really up to the adults to BELIEVE the child (no one would make something so horrible up) and to report it. A child cannot be expected to make such decisions. The abuser might have even appealed to a sense of 'shame' (which belongs to the abuser) and said that the child would destroy the family if anyone found out.
I was sexually abused. The only thing that was worse than the abuse was thinking of hurting my mom, who was completely crushed when I was forced to tell her. I thought, "If I could just deal with this alone, if I could just keep this secret, I wouldn't have to hurt anybody else. They could be happy." But I understand now that it was her responsibility to help, not mine to protect her. She failed to protect me.
engkatiemarie: I understand your fervor at wanting the worst possible punishments for these abusers. However, it's not as simple as you say it is.
I think you;re minimizing all the hardships that abused children deal with. They're relatively powerless in their situation. What if the person they tell doesn't believe them? What if they're blamed? These will make the trauma worse for the child. The abuser has used every trick in the book to keep the kid quiet, because they NEED the kid to stay quiet. If the child tells, you know they'll deny it and call the child a liar.
You also don't seem to understand how this abuse works. The person abusing is also the child's father/brother/uncle/mother/trusted adult and had a loving relationship with the child. The abuser may use this to manipulate the child into staying quiet. The child may also love this person as a relative... but that by no means implies that they "want" abuse. The child is confused because they want this person to stop their horrible behavior and be a "normal" trusted guardian... and they're afraid that telling will make them be locked up forever. A child may or may not want a harsh punishment.
I believe what you say is true, that the child's needs should be put first.
These crimes have high recidivism rates... because no matter how long the sentence, these people come out and find ways to keep abusing.
I believe they should be punished... yes, but the only way for them to truly reform is to completely empathize with the victim. To understand why their actions are wrong. Abusers are people who think the victim is responsible for their actions. They need to understand the horrors that they put the survivors through... and they need to honestly feel sorry. Of course, this requires compassion, which I'm not sure some abusers have, but I think this is the way to go.
It's a lot more complicated than people would like to think. Children don't have the agency adults have.
Child Molesters are the lowest form of being, they do not deserve to live.
As a note,
Many abused children go on to become abusers.
Child abusers make me sick,
but I would not go so far as to say anyone does not deserve to live.
I would.
Allowing them to continue is perpetuating the circle of abuse.
What counts as abuse, and who decides?
Is anything that a bunch of hick legislators call abuse, actually abusive? And to the point that it ought to deprive someone of their live? These are the questions we need to begin asking ourselves, if we are going to call ourselves intelligent and civilized, let alone "progressive".
Any act which is perpetuated on a child (someone under the age of consent) is abuse.
Also, any act perpetuated on a person who does not reciprocate is abuse.
These are self-evident; why do you choose to debate them?
Your first statement is a tautology. Self-evident? Well, yes, tautologies always are. Meaningful? Not really.
Your second statement is incomprehensible.
The issue under debate is whether everything that is illegal ought to be illegal. For some reason, this is the only subject about which it's not considered permissible to even ask the question. The usual answer is "But it's ABUSE!!!!" , which is not an answer at all, but a restatement of the premise.
So which law, exactly, do you disagree with?
I guess I am having difficulty relating to your thought process here.
It's not popular to say this, but often it is not reported because everyone involved is a willing participant and are, more or less, satisfied with the situation. We ought to be able to realize that just because the law labels something abuse doesn't mean that it is unpleasant to the people involved.
This is unpleasant for everyone except the molester. Forcing sexuality upon children and stealing their childhood is disgusting and destructive.
With all respect, you are mistaken, and sex crimes investigators know this better than anyone else. Plenty of investigations reveal that some victims are willing, even enthusiastic participants in sexual abuse situations, including intrafamilial ones. I'm sorry to have to buck public stereotypes, but it's a fact.
Now, whether the situation is "disgusting and destructive" is not the same question as whether it is "unpleasant."
It is disgusting and destructive to force sex on children.
Whether children are willing or not, it is abuse and it is disgusting and the person performing the act should be jailed.
In most states, you have to be at least 16 to give consent, and even then, if a 16 or 17 year old child is "willing" it is abuse.
See my blog http://progressiveu.org/003838-the-girl-who-cried-rape-or-in-this-case-d... if you care to delve more into the argument.
But either way, it is you who are mistaken.
It's still disgusting abuse if children are "willing." The adult is still the responsible one meant to be... wow... RESPONSIBLE!
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If You Swear That There's No Truth And Who Cares, How Come You Say It Like You're Right? [Bright Eyes]
http://progressiveu.org/143541-how-to-survive-the-2008-elections
I think you need to learn how to read, friend.
The question at issue was, why doesn't this get reported. Not "is it or is it not 'disgusting abuse'."
I know what the legal age of consent is. I have a degree in Criminal Justice, I probably know more about it than you do. You just contradicted yourself by the way:
If the age of consent is 16 (which it is in most states), that means that if a 16-year-old consents to sex it is not legally construed as abuse. That's why it's called an "age of consent."
We ought, as self-identified "progressives", to have the brains to look past the propaganda and ask ourselves whether everything the law classifies as abuse is actually abusive. If we can't exercise that much intellectual independence, we're not good for much.
Sorry i didn't make that more clear... i meant it should still be construed as abuse especially when it's in the family.
Now, rereading yours and EKM's comments, I can see why I was confused by the argument, but I do understand that I was mistaken.
However, in way too many cases, someone other than the "consenting" child and the "abusive" adult know about the situation, and fail to speak up.
I think we can all agree that something needs to be done.
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If You Swear That There's No Truth And Who Cares, How Come You Say It Like You're Right? [Bright Eyes]
http://progressiveu.org/143541-how-to-survive-the-2008-elections
You say that it's not abuse and not reported because everyone is fine with the situation. Tell that to the child who is threatened to stay quiet, is beaten if he or she tries to tell, and has to contend with a society that would rather look the other way.
"well, why didn't you just tell? If you didn't, that means you like it."
No, it means the abuser was that invested in protecting themself. The abuser had to cajole, bribe, threaten, or use other ways of keeping the kid quiet. The abuser might have promised toys or candy. The abuser might have said they'd kill the child's parent or pet. It doesn't matter. It's coercion. It does not mean the kid "was ok with" the abuse.
Furthermore, society tells kids sex is dirty and they're dirty if they're exposed to it. Who would want to tell and deal with everyone shaming them?
A lot of kids DO try to tell and are silenced. I think there's a lot more to it than thinking children are either "willing participants" (as you so nicely put it) or are abused victims. They have to contend with so many powerful forces out of their control, and have to face more than you could ever imagine. Please don't insult these children by assuming to know.