Michael Vick's image has been destroyed based on allegations. Okay, I understand that what he has been charged with is very hateful,violent,and disturbing, but it is not fair for him to be criticized in that matter based off allegations. To be honest it has gone way too far!!! He has not been convicted of anything and the public is treating him as if he was handed the guilty verdict from day one. The public has rushed to judement way too early!! The reason why this has gone this far is because of PETA, who have been looking for a scapegoat to represent this violent crime. Now that they've got IT they want to pour it on!!! I also think that this is racially fueled!! Okay I'm black so you may think I'm rooting for Vick, well I am because he is a great talent but I do think he may have betted on some dogfights but killing the dogs, I just dont see it! On the other hand there are people who've hated Vick ever since the day he was drafted 1st pick overall, some of those people are black and some white and in my opinion this dogfighting incident has given those people mostly white to hate him even more and see him fail!! And if you dont believe there is a racial divide, go and search the topic because on the day of the protest of opening day OF training camp for the Falcons there were PETA signs being held by a majority of white people and there was a crowd rooting for Vick, whom were MAJORITY black!! This has come to a point where you may get hurt (literally) for wearing a vick jersey or falcons colors period in Atlanta. Ga. That's ridiculous!!! Threats are being made conserning pulling Vick's Jersey off the shelves. Now once again I am not saying Vick is innocent. I dont know ,that's up to the court to decide, which means that the public should not treat this man as if he has been convicted. I say hold your judgement and let it play out in court. It is really bad when we as Americans preach "INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY" BUT IN THIS CASE WE ARE PREACHING HE IS GUILTY WITHOUT A TRIAL!! tHANK yOU
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First, welcome to ProgressiveU. If you need help or have questions, check out the FAQs or post to the forums. Links to both are at the top of each page.
Second, users really like when posts are broken into obvious paragraphs. Reading one long paragraph with no space in between is hard on the eyes. Quite a few users refuse to even finish reading posts that are one long paragraph.
Third, I agree that the jury is the one to convict. However, I don't care if you're black, white, purple or green; dogfighting is disgusting and you deserve every ounce of anger and punishment that's tossed your way. To say the entire issue is racially motivated is a huge stretch for me. The man had all sorts of paraphernalia in his home, which is part of why people are as outraged as they are. This man was, whether he wanted the post or not, also a role model. When role models do things like this, people react. The fact that he's black has no bearing whatsoever on my opinion on this, nor on the opinions of many that I have heard speak out about this. The fact that he was disgusting enough to make dogs fight to the death for his enjoyment is the problem.
"It is never too late to give up your prejudices." Henry David Thoreau
"In case of dissension, never dare to judge till you've heard the other side." Euripides
Angela A. Washington
One he did not live in that house, he bought that house for family, not saying he is not responsible cause he is he owns the house, but it's kind of hard to know whats going on when you are in a different state playing for or preparing for a football team 60% of the year.
Two, we seem to forget that there are three other people charged alone with Vick. Okay Vick is a famous quarterback and will receive the brunt of this but if you going to do that be fair criticize the others TOO!!!
Third, To say there is no racial divide is crazy in my opinion because I live in Atlanta and I,ve seen it first hand. For a white person to turn her nose up at me because I was supporting Vick and wearing a Vick jersey is crazy.Oh there is a racial divide. And I wonder what if this was Peyton Manning or Tom Brady would it be the same.
Fourth, I am a fair person so I totally see your point of view but for a person who is living in Atlanta I see the real picture.
Fifth, I am not prejudice if that's what you are implying by typing the Thoreau quote at the end. I'm just calling it how I see it!
My response in order of your points.
1) According to the indictment, this wasn't just happening in that one house but in other places and possibly other states as well. It doesn't matter if you live in the house or not. That's not what this is about. This is about evidence that has been gathered that indicates that Vick took an active role in the dogfighting that took place on the property he owned. The evidence points to him. That's my issue here. Perhaps I didn't word that well the first time around. The evidence found in this home that he owns points to him as being involved. If he didn't own the house and the evidence pointed to him, he'd still be in just as deep a hole as he is now.
2) It's not that we have forgotten that other people are involved as well. They're all equally responsible. Vick, however, is getting so much attention because he name is well known in certain circles. If the other 3 involved were as well known as he, they'd be dodging the mud just as much as Vick. Is it fair that he's the one that's getting the attention? Probably not, but I don't feel sorry for him either. When you decide to step into a high profile job, you accept the consequences that particular decision will render.
3) I don't live in Atlanta, nor do millions of others that have chimed in on this case. Atlanta isn't everywhere. I based my opinion that this isn't racially motivated issue on what I have seen from people all over the place that have said their piece on this issue. Maybe some of the white folks in Atlanta are turning their noses up at you because you're black and wearing a Vick jersey. I imagine though that there are just as many elsewhere that are going to turn their noses up at a white person who wears a Vick jersey right now; not because he is black but because of the charges he has been indicted on.
4) The real picture isn't just Atlanta. You can't say this is a racially divided issue just because it appears that way in Atlanta. This issue is national, and nationally, I've seen just as many black people express outrage at Vick as I have white people say "cut the guy a break." Maybe there is a racial divide in Atlanta over the issue, but there isn't everywhere else. Looking at the real picture means looking further than what is right in front of our eyes because the real picture encompasses all of it, not just what we see right there in front of us.
5) That quote is one of two attached to my signature. It has been for days and will be for at least another two weeks before I change it again to something else I like and think bears repeating. It was not directed at you any more than it is directed at any one else I reply to on ProU.
And finally, like I said, it is up to the jury to convict. And if he's guilty, he's a disgusting human being and deserves every ounce of censure and punishment that is tossed his way. The same goes for the other three involved. And anyone else that thinks it's okay to make animals tear the hell out of each other and then kill or mistreat the one's that don't win. I have no sympathy for anyone who does those things, and even less for those who then want to play the "poor me, I'm being scapegoated" card. They made the bed, they can sleep in it.
"It is never too late to give up your prejudices." Henry David Thoreau
"In case of dissension, never dare to judge till you've heard the other side." Euripides
I agree that he deserves due process. People are rushing to convict him and he hasn't even been tried. His indictment was based on testamony of some people who were involved, and they were probably more concerned with saving themselves so who knows how trustworthy it is. And also, as far as his career goes, look at Kobe Bryant. He was accused of rape--one of the most horrible crimes, in my opinion--and was not only allowed to play basketball during the proceedings, but also returned to his lucrative career after the charges were dropped.
Of course, dogfighting is a horrible crime, but so is rape. Kobe Bryant was given due process and so should Michael Vick.
PS: I do agree that there is a racial component of this issue, particularly in the perception of Vick. It's been reported that more whites are in favor of punishing him, and more black people are calling for due process. Undeniably, our legal system is not completely colorblind so I hope he receives a fair trial.
As much as we want to believe that every one is innocent until proven guilty - even more than that we love to see the rich fall...
I guess that might be one of America's biggest flaws - we build up celebrities and allow them to take over our loves and news, then can't wait to tear them down into nothing.
So sad...
But it happens: OJ, Michael Jackson - and both of these men were acquitted but people still will not leave them alone or stop the rumors/dirty looks. No one wanted to see them get acquitted and few of the people who were certain og their guilt prior to their trials have changed their minds.
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Fanaile Essence,
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I knew he was guilty the whole time,
when you looked at the facts of the case there was no way for him to be innocent.
he had no chance, and if you would have known the information you would have thought the same thing.
Don't try to blame this on PETA, this was a federal investigation of Michael Vick and of course PETA is glad that a dog fighter is apprehended because it is sick and WRONG. PETA isn't the only agency that cares, all of his sponsors do, as well as the ASPCA, HSUS, as well as many others.
It does not have to do with liking Michael Vick or not, it has to do with FACTS, facts that from the begining showed he had no way out.
Yeah you are innocent until proven guilty OR GIVEN ADEQUATE EVIDENCE TO ASSUME GUILT.
Oh please. The federal government completely sensationalized the indictment in order to villanize Vick. If he would have been guilty of everything they claimed he did--or better yet, had they been able to prove he was guilty--they would have never let him take the plea deal. The indictment was predominately based on the testimonies of his 'friends', who were probably more concerned with saving their own behinds than telling the truth. So we'll never know the true facts of what Vick did or didn't do, beyond what he has admitted.
What he has admitted is bad enough in my eyes.
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~Fallon~
"Do not be too moral. You may cheat yourself out of much life. Aim above morality. Be not simply good; be good for something." Henry David Thoreau
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Actually he would have gotten much worse without the plea deal, that is why is is called a PLEA DEAL. He admitted he was guilty and he knew he had no way to win. They gave him a plea deal so that he, in turn, would release more names of people who are involved in this disgusting, cruel, heartless activity.
Not necessarily. Clearly the federal government was unable to prove all of the allegations against him. If there weren't holes in their case, they wouldn't have offered the plea deal. For Vick's case, as would be for anyone who's career is dependent on his/her public image, it was better just to plea and hope that the whole situation would go away than let the case drag on.
And they didn't give him the plea deal so he would give up names. It's obvious that he was the one they were gunning for in the first place. The big money item. Once they had Vick, they could probably care less about who else may have even been involved, as evident in the fact that one man who was involved in the dogfighting operation walked away with no charges brought against him. I wonder why...ah yes, because he gave up Vick's name as being involved. Stop trying to sensationalize the issue. No one cared about the dogs. Dogfighting goes on in many areas nationwide and I guarantee you that the people they do convict of it are not on the front page, even if they kill more dogs than Vick did. It's all about the money.
actually it is in the news otherwise. Someone was just convicted to life for having 30 dogs on his property. How many less than Vick is that and look how much more he got. Vick is getting a slap on the wrist compared to that and he was 100 times bigger in the dog fighting world than him. You don't try to make Vick out to look like a good person because he is not in any way. He is planning on releasing names as well, so stay informed. You don't seem to know much of what you are talking about, you just want to be right and that won't happen. Michael Vick is sick and heartless, and a lot of people care about the dogs in this incident. It isn't all about money, it is our government doing something about a major problem we are having. Dogfighting affects many things in this country, you probably just don't realize that.
Please. I'm not trying to make Vick look like a good person. I'm not justifying his actions. They were stupid, point blank. I do, however, have a problem with the way the media has villified him, as obvious by the same statements you spew about him being "heartless" and "sick." You can judge Vick for his actions, but the more you judge him as a person, the more judgemental and self-righteous you appear.
Don't get it twisted: I'm not taking up for Vick. It's the media's handling of the event, which you seem to be buying into, that bothers me more than anything.
The way the media has handled the whole situation is as if dogfighting was the worst thing Vick could have done. A bad crime, yes. But the worse? I'm sorry, but no. Hear about the 6 people who captured a 20-year-old woman, sexually assualted her, stabbed her, beat her, tortured her, and forced her to eat rat and dog feces and drink out of the toilet? That's far more sickening to me than dogfighting. Let's see how much press that gets.
Another example: Vick's former teammate, Patrick Kearney, had a 'rape allegation' against him earlier this year. A woman was raped at his home. He claims that he didn't know about the attack. Says that he was sleeping during the attack. Remember the huge media coverage of this event, including the villifying of Kearney, the indefinite suspension he received and the pending court trial? No? Me either. That's because the media didn't go after him the way they've gone after Vick. And I'm sorry, but a brutal sexual attack on a woman is worse than animal cruelty.
I plan to one day work for the ASPCA, so I am very passionate about animal rights. I also own my own pitbull, and cannot believe that people could do that in the first place, but also give the breed such a bad reputation when they are incredible dogs. You can judge the soul of a man by his treatment of animals, so I am perfectly legitimate in calling him heartless. You cannot do that to a poor, defensless animal. They can't stop it, they have no voice. I am not "buying into it." I have done plenty of research on dog fighting and this incident from many sorces, and I stay informed on what else is going on. The media can "villify" him, just like anyone else, and I can still have my personal hatrid for him for my own reasons.
Angela A. Washington
So you will forever and always hate Michael Vick as long as you are living. Wow that's pretty sad because it does nothing for him; it only eats away at you. You know there are people in the grave who still feel hate toward people still living on the earth. As I said before it does nothing for you at all. So I guess you don't forgive or forget.
Don't get me wrong he did the wrong thing and he will be punished for that but I don't hate him I forgive him and he is a good person( you would know that if you did any research on what he has done for the city of Atlanta and his hometown in Va.). For someone to judge wether they hate someone on one wrong is INSANE!!!!!
It just like the racism back in the slavery and the 60's when whites hated black because of their color and did not take the chance to know them.
I won't let it eat away at me, I will just not like him.
"You can judge the soul of a man by his treatment of animals."
He is nobody special, he is not a role model..I'm sorry, but because of that he isn't and can never be in my book. He has done good, and I know that, but it was all on a bed of lies, in a sense.
Angela A. Washington
I feel sorry for you but I wish you some luck in life. Ignorance gets you no where and the guy admitted his guilt and apologized to everyone. People just love to bring down and criticize a successful person when everything goes wrong.
How long did it take for him to appologize? He is a rat.
I do not like him, and do not have to.
I'm sure there are people you will never like either, and at least i have good reason. I am not ignorant, that is the thing.
For someone to judge wether they hate someone on one wrong is INSANE!!!!!
It may seem insane, but it's also completely common. If someone murdered your sibling, you would undoubtedly feel hate towards that person based off of that one wrong. If someone murdered your favorite pet, you would feel hate towards that person for that one wrong. How do you feel towards the men that drove airplanes into the World Trade Center? Men that rape? Women that kidnap babies? The list goes on. People that have done these things are often hated based on ONE wrong. To judge her hate for his actions as insane isn't particularly fair when nearly everyone judges and hates based on one wrong, whether we like to admit it or not.
Further, to associate her dislike of Vick because of what he did with slavery and segregation is ridiculous. My guess would be, as strongly as she feels about animals, she would feel that same anger and hate towards ANYONE sick enough to force animals to fight and then kill those who don't meet his or her standards.
Contrary to popular belief, this is not something that happened to Vick, this is something that he did. He is not a victim here. He made a choice to do what he did. To then castigate her as being racist because she dislikes what he did and cannot see him as a good person because of what he did is uncalled for.
And on a final note, as hard as it may be to fathom, it isn't always about race. Sometimes it's about feeling strongly about the disgusting behavior of another human, whether they be of another race or not.
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~Fallon~
"Do not be too moral. You may cheat yourself out of much life. Aim above morality. Be not simply good; be good for something." Henry David Thoreau
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"My guess would be, as strongly as she feels about animals, she would feel that same anger and hate towards ANYONE sick enough to force animals to fight and then kill those who don't meet his or her standards. "
Thank you! It is nothing against Vick just because he's famous. It doesn't matter what race he is. It is because of what he did -- the actions are what is the issue here, any dogfighter I have the same feelings towards. No more, no less. I don't even really enjoy football, so I had no dislike or anything towards him before this. It is the fact of what he did.
Of course, if you want to hate him it's your perogative, but it's still pretty pathetic. His contract and endorsements are gone, pubic image ruined, career gone, and he's facing jail time. The animal rights people already got their pound of flesh. What more do you want from the man?